Tami Simon: You’re listening to Insights at the Edge. Today my guest is Dr. Richard Bartlett. Richard holds a doctorate in chiropractic and naturopathic medicine from Bastyr University. Early in his career as a chiropractor, he experienced a life-changing event that redirected the entire course o f his clinical experience. He’s the author of the ground-breaking program with Sounds True, The Matrix Energetics Experience: Shift Your Consciousness with the Healing Energies and Hidden Frequencies of the Universe. In The Matrix Energetics Experience, Richard takes students on the freewheeling, playful, and possibility-expanding journey that shatters preconceptions about the seemingly solid universe we live in, and how unlimited our potential to change truly is.

In this episode of Insights at the Edge, Richard and I spoke about the field of the heart and torsion-fueled physics. We also talked about the role of intention in Matrix Energetics. Richard also introduced us to a core method of Matrix Energetics. He calls it a form of training wheels. It’s a methodology called the Two-Point. He also showed us, in a very specific example, how we can use the Two-Point in our lives. Finally, we talked about how it’s through play that we eventually discover our unlimited potential. Here’s my very intriguing conversation with Dr. Richard Bartlett.

Richard, I’d love to know about your discovery of Matrix Energetics. My understanding is that we go back in time to something like 1996. You’re working as a chiropractor, and some type of break-through experience happens. Something like that.

Richard Bartlett: Well, I was going to school, learning to be a naturopathic physician after working as a chiropractor for 12 years. So I was taking 37 credit hours a semester plus labs, and then I had to actually drive to Montana once a weekend, which was a 13 hour drive one way, in order to work as a chiropractor there because I didn’t have a license.

So I was kind of on a Sufi quest for enlightenment, sort of like Charles Lindbergh going across the Atlantic. I was out of my body a lot. I was totally stressed, overwhelmed, drinking a lot of coffee, because you don’t want wind up in a ditch in the road somewhere in Montana on the way to your job. And then I would work all day for two days, then I would get back in the car, come back to Seattle and take a test. So that’s the terrain that this thing happened in.

I don’t know exactly to this day what happened, but I will tell you. Like it says in my first book, I had a young mother bring her child in, the last patient of the day on a long Saturday. And [the child] had a lazy eye, and [the mother] told me the surgeons said, “There’s nothing we can do for her, we’re just going to watch it and see if it gets better.” And she told me that wasn’t good enough for her, and asked me if I could do something.

And I was so out of it, I went off rambling into a story about Superman in the ‘50s—George Reeves, that Superman. It was story about a blind girl, and I think my subconscious was making connections while I was telling the story, because there was no apparent reason for me rambling on about it. And then I finished the story, which ends with the little girl getting her eyesight back, flying around the world with Superman, Superman getting her parents back together, and then meeting in a New York apartment. It’s a very beautiful little 28-minute story.

The mother was looking at me like—well, they know I’m crazy there in Seattle, but she was looking at me like, “Why are you telling me this?” Then all of a sudden I looked to my left, and behind me there was George Reeves as Superman, or somebody who looked a lot like him, standing there with his x-ray vision beaming into the little girl that was our concern, and I saw a blockage in the little girl’s head. It was kind of like a black I-don’t-know-what. And because I could see it, I knew what I needed to do. I needed to relieve that blockage.

Now, I had a problem. Little children bite. There are some “cranial techniques” that you can do where you stick your finger into the roof of the mouth of a person and you can move the cranial bones from the inside. And that could have relieved the blockage. But I know from experience from my son, because I tried that on him, he bit me like a snapping turtle and I was not in the mood to repeat that experience ever.

So that’s probably why I went with the vision, or maybe even why I saw the vision, because there wasn’t anything else. And because I saw this blockage, I thought, “I’m just going to go with the big guy in blue,” and I touched the forehead of the child. Some flash of light appeared to occur on my inner sight, there were pathways in her nervous system that I could see where the light traveled down to the base of her skull where her vision center is—the occipital lobe—and then I bounced back up, and in the next moment, she was blinking at me and she told me “there’s two of you!”

Well, we see with binocular vision, and then what happens is as we get adapted to that, our nervous system superimposes the two images to make a stereoscopic image, which gives us our perception of depth. Well, for the first time in her life, that eye was functioning normally, so she was temporarily seeing double because she had not yet learned to superimpose the two images. That was the beginning of what now is called Matrix Energetics. And quite a bizarre beginning it is.

TS: Now, help me understand a little bit what happened when you touched her from the outside so you wouldn’t get bitten. What was going on then?

RB: I just touched her with one finger on the forehead, and I just watched, literally, as this light appeared to be directed through her forehead, break up the blockage, shoot down into the occipital lobe, bounce back, and then [as] it was coming out, I could see her eyes sparkling. That was the long and short of it, I didn’t do anything.

TS: OK, now you call Matrix Energetics a “technology of consciousness.” So help me understand [it]. Perhaps by unpacking this term I’ll get a little more insight into what’s actually going on here.

RB: Sure. Well, the problem with techniques is techniques are based upon some person’s experience, and then from that experience they subscribe a set a rules in order to recreate the experience.

It’s like you’re in a laboratory and you’re mixing a couple of inorganic compounds in order to yield another compound, or a substrate. You have to put in so much of the one and so much of the other, heat it just right, heat it for so long under this temperature, and then you filter it, so on and so forth. So those would be the rule sets that are inherit with any technique. Every technique has a set of rules. The set of rules create a perceptual bias that put you in the box of the person who had the original experience.

Now, I think that those rules narrowly allow you to tap in—like you plug an electric cord into an appliance, you’re plugging into what Rupert Sheldrake calls a morphic field. [The morphic field] is a field of consciousness that is specified to the rule sets, the learning, the experiences, and the understanding that is packed into that particular field of energy that is unique to the technique. So I think all techniques are actually morphic fields, and if you can create a morphic field that says, “The rules are actually that there aren’t any,” that’s a different rule set that changes the perceptual bias and allows you to go beyond your experience of a rigid expectation set, so that miracles can then occur within the spaces between your expectations.

TS: So when you call Matrix Energetics a technology, you’re distinguishing it from techniques?

RB: Absolutely. A technique will not get you to miracles. It will get you to process. You can do step one or step two, or maybe you reverse step one or two. You better not if you have a very arrogant teacher or somebody who really believes it must be done his way or the highway. I’ve had a number of those. In order to get to point B, you have to go through point A. Once you go to point B, your outcome is point C. Just like this chemical formula that I talked about, where you mix this compound with this substance, and what it yields is this compound or substrate.

That’s not the way Matrix Energetics works. It does not work by intent, it does not work by running energy, it does not work by any of the traditional rules. It actually does not even work in the realm of classical physics. It works somewhat in the realm of quantum physics, as a field effect, but it probably even transcends that, based upon the kind of effects we see. It probably actually works in the realm of something called “torsion field physics,” which the Russians are the masters of. It was also the same physics that Tesla discovered and called “longitudinal acoustic standing waves.”

Basically, it is a way of tapping into infinite potential through the zero-point field that then releases energy into this domain. But it is actually not the running of energy, the visualization of energy, the creation of an outcome by doing a specific thing. It’s quite the opposite of that. It actually is about getting into the field of your heart, which is gigantic. It’s like 5,000 times stronger electromagnetically than the field of your brain. [It’s about] getting into the field of your heart, getting into an altered state of consciousness, hence the consciousness in the technology, and then getting out of the way. This is pretty much the prescription for miracles in everything I’ve ever read.

TS: OK. You’re saying a lot of things here, Richard, and I’m going to try to follow you here. I’m very interested in this idea of the field of the heart. So tell me what we know about the field of the heart, especially in relation to what you call “torsion physics.”

RB: Torsion field physics, yes. Well, OK. First let’s unpack the word “torsion.” Torsion is just a spin or a twist. If you think of a tornado or a hurricane, that’s a torsion field. You’ve got this intense spinning energy, and then at its center, you’ve got a null point where there’s actually a change in the way the laws of physics behave.

For instance, if you’ve ever seen pictures or heard about a straw being driven through a tree, it’s now thought by some scientists who have studied this form of physics that actually the straw is not driven into the tree by the force of the wind. It actually dematerialized and manifests within the tree intact. Now, this is very interesting because it ties into some forbidden archeology, where we actually found frogs and things like that alive embedded in granite hundreds of feet down [when] we’ve opened it up. Now, they haven’t lived very long, but the only way they could have actually got there is to have been teleported there.

And the physics of teleportation, we talk about it a little bit in quantum physics, but the Russians are actually working on mastering that—your basic “beam me up, Scotty.” That allows for you to exist outside of the normal confines of time and space. Now, if you exist outside of those normal confines, you also exist outside of the laws of classical, conventional physics.

The heart itself is a torsion field, it’s a spinning field. This has been proven—it’s been seen by NASA researchers and others. The first thing that forms in the embryos is actually a pulse, which is at 72 beats a minute, and that pulse is driven by what they can clearly see [as] a whirling vortex that then becomes the physical heart later on in the development of the embryo.

TS: I have to say, when you started talking about the teleporting frogs, I went off a little bit there. Now what are you saying? Frogs teleported into granite? I’m sorry, Richard, help me.

RB: Yes, they were found alive inside of granite, sometimes hundreds of feet down. They’ve also found things other than frogs, but frogs are the thing I’m particularly remembering right now. They’ve been found inside of and embedded in trees, petrified trees, and they were alive.

Again, this breaks all the rules of our conventional expectations. But if you get outside of the confines of the normal play of time and space, these things make sense. It’s only when you resume your relationships with what you would call the classical realm of physics, time, and space. That’s where the rules have to apply uniquely to the way they’ve been set up. Now, I will tell you, if one person in the world can truly levitate—and there’s a lot of evidence to suggest some of the saints or the Tibetan masters, they can do these things for real, not as a trick—then you’ve got a different set of laws of physics working that transcend what we would normally believe to be the rule set that we work within.

Now, what’s important about that—frogs are not so important here, but the idea is—if you can get into the field of the heart, which is a torsion field, which by its very nature transcends the laws of normal time-space, you now have an interval of infinity. And that interval—what George Lucas called the “space between the spaces”—is where you contact infinite possibility. That’s where you can uncollapse the experience of a physical condition, a pattern, a disease, an event, and experience it differently, because the laws are completely different at that level.

TS: Now, you mentioned the word “miracles,” and, you know, I noticed that I have kind of a double-sided response when I hear that word. On the one hand, I’m excited about it, I want to know what you mean, I want to know the kinds of miracles you’ve seen and that you’ve seen through Matrix Energetics.

RB: [Laughs]

TS: You laughed, so we probably don’t have enough time to hear about all the miracles, but I could hear a couple. But at the same time, some part of me is also suspicious and concerned that people who actually really need miracle healing, who have been praying and asking for it and not receiving it, might just be like, “What are you talking about, Tami? You and Richard are talking about miracles, what is this?”

RB: I believe the reason that people do not experience miracles is because they need them. If you need a miracle, is what happens is you’re focusing on lack. You’re focusing on what’s not happening. You’re saying, “Is it different yet? Are we there yet, mommy?” You know, like if you get in your car with your kids and you’re going to go on a long drive—I’ve had this experience—and you pull out of the driveway and already the kids are yelling, “Are we there yet?” and you’ve got 27 hours to go. You understand what I’m talking about.

It’s the anticipation, the expectation, the need for miracles that precludes them from occurring, because the way we perceive miracles, we perceive them as something that happens to us that changes us in order that we can get rid of our problems or transcend our suffering. Once you embrace suffering, embrace your problems, let go of you need to change anything, you can then be neutral. And when you’re in neutral, there’s no charge upon an experience, therefore one experience is equally weighted with another experience. Once there’s no charge on an outcome, the outcome can actually change. But in order to get to the point of no charge, you have to stop thinking.

Now, I’m not talking about meditating. I’m talking about letting go so that your thoughts can run on, do whatever they want, go on forever if you like, build castles in the sand or fortresses or places of protection, and you go to the point in your heart where there are no thoughts, there are no feelings, there are no emotions, and there are no rules. And from that point, you touch infinity—literally in the blink of an eye your entire life can change. And I’ve seen it over and over again, not only though myself, which I don’t consider to be particularly good at this, but through the people that have attended one seminar—or did not attend a seminar, just read a book. They have had what I would call miracles, what they would call miracles, because they transcend the normal expectation set of what has to happen in order for something to occur.

In other words, if you cut your hand, and if it were to heal instantly, that breaks the laws [that say] “healing takes time.” Well, time itself—our concept of time—dictates how things play out. When you get to a point of timelessness and spacelessness, you actually have arrived at a point of your being, a fiery point of your essence that transcends all those rule sets. Now the question becomes, “Are you pretending to let go, but still looking for an outcome? Or [have] you truly let go, and the outcome occurs?”

It’s like when the saints would levitate, and I do believe they did, they levitated because they got so deeply in prayer or in meditation or in supplication or in joy, whatever you want to call it, that they entered into the chamber of their heart, the sacred field of their heart, and from that point they transcended gravity. They transcended time-space. They transcended the rules.

Padre Pio is a very good example. In World War II, there was a bomber group that was going to bomb railroad tracks and a munitions plant. And Padre Pio was serving Sunday Mass. All of a sudden, the pilot of the lead of the B-17 bombers saw Padre Pio floating in the air above him with his hand outstretched, saying, “Go back.” The reason Padre Pio was there [was] he said, “You’re too close to the town, you’re going to hurt innocent people.” So the pilot turned the bomber squad back away from where they might have bombed innocent [people]. When they landed, he went to church, and when we went to church, there was Padre Pio, serving Mass in the little villa there.

So that’s just one example of transcending time and space, being in two places at once, what you might call a miracle—certainly not your expectation set, [certainly] outside of the rules, outside of your perceptual biases. Things occur, really, in spite of you. That’s what I think miracles are. They don’t occur because of you, because of what you pray, because of what you do, because of what you believe, because of what you want, because of what you wish you could have or have tried to get rid of. They occur in spite of you and they are grace. And that grace, I think, actually dwells within the sphere or the realm of the heart.

TS: Now, one of the things that’s confusing to me about Matrix Energetics is the role of—

RB: Just one? [Laughs]

TS: Just one, I mean, yes, it’s a long list, but we’ll start here, which is the role of intention. And I say that because as you’re talking, it sounds like there is no real place for intention. I’m moving beyond anything I might want to get out of working with this technology. And yet it also seems like there is a role for intention. So help me understand this.

RB: You’re right, it’s very paradoxical. And the reason is because it’s a left brain right brain equation. You see, the left brain, it functions in the domain of time-space. Now, I will say—I’ll be a little more prickly—I don’t think it functions in time and space, I think the left brain experience of our perceptions creates our experience of time and space.

Now, collectively we create it together. It’s not that it doesn’t exist, it’s that if you have millions and millions of people—trillions, I guess, or billions certainly—creating an experience together collectively of a thing called time and space, we are going to experience it. And we’re not always going to tell the different. For instance, if we throw ourselves off a building, we’re not going to levitate, we’re going to fall. We’re not going to walk through walls or any of these things, because those are outside of the normal expectation set of our perceptual bias. This is why people like Carlos Castaneda, with his guru Don Juan, took mushrooms. It’s why the Tibetan monks go meditate in caves and they deny the world, or whatever. They have to get outside of the limiting field or vortex of our own expectations for how things happen, what is real, what is not real, what is allowed and what is not.

Most of what is allowed and what is not [allowed] is not based upon what actually is—[it is based upon] the way we perceive it to be. Everyone’s perceptions are different, so each person has a different angle on what reality is. They have a different take on what’s real, what’s not real, what’s possible, what they can do, what they can expect, what’s outside of their dreams and expectations, and what can be included. So this means what you’ve got, essentially, is you’ve got many many intimate subsets of possibilities that are embodied by these fields of energy. Think of these fields as intelligent equations that run mindlessly based upon what’s been programmed into them. That’s essentially what you’re talking about.

In order to transcend the limitations of your expectations, you can’t do it by intending to do it. If you intend to do something, or you visualize something, or you try to make something happen, it is your left brain that is the doer. You are not the doer, you are the door, and the door leads to this infinite field through the doorway of your heart. The door actually is the field of the heart. The field of the heart, I believe, has nothing to do with love. It has nothing to do with emotions. It has nothing to do with your thoughts. It is actually a null point, like in the center of the tornado, where things can occur because the laws of time and space, of conventional physics, and even of the mind, the emotions, the expectations, are suspended there. If you were to go there, you would feel nothing, hear nothing, see nothing, be able to perceive nothing, from your left brain.

Now, that said, the left brain is a linear processor. So what it does is it puts together our experiences—I don’t remember how fast, extremely fast, but basically frame by frame, there’s a limit of 28 bytes per second. They used to say 7 to 12, we’re up to 28 now. That creates the linear experience based upon our perceptual bias of what we perceive to be out there as our physical, three-dimensional reality.

What physicists say—and I have some friends [who] say this [who] are world-class physicists—there is no “out there” out there. What’s actually out there [are] fields of information that then create interference patterns. Kind of like if you saw, with Sean Connery and Catherine Zeta-Jones, Entrapment, where she’s in a field of lasers and she has to flip her body and she has to move certain ways to get around that field. Well, if you can imagine each one of those squares where the lasers are as a particular slice of reality, a particular field or perception, and you move through those, you have to get to the other side someway.

Now, this is why, again, [there is] meditation, drugs—there are various ways. But if you enter an altered state of consciousness, your left brain can’t function effectively there, or not as effectively. What happens is your right brain, which can process probably a trillion bytes of information per second—maybe it’s limitless, but we’ll say a trillion. Scientists have said a million, but I smell a rat. If you say [that] you’ve measured the right brain process a million bytes of information per second, what grad student did that research that confirmed it was a million bytes? They’re making it up. So if they’re going to make it up, let’s make it up really good. Let’s say a trillion bytes of information.

The problem is, you would not perceive being able to process that trillion bytes of information from your normal waking state. The laws of the left brain would slow you down to the linear expectations that say, “This occurs first, cause and effect, then this.” That’s why there’s only a forward direction in time, it moves from the present to the future [and] never moves to the past. That’s why you can’t experience parallel universes or parallel realities. That’s why you can’t grow a tail, or whatever. The rules are different in this realm, and we all agree to those differences and agree to play by those rules, even if only subconsciously.

However, when you alter your consciousness enough, you actually move out of the left-brain linear logic, and this creates the amorphous, right-brain experience. [This experience] is more based upon sensations, color, symbol, feeling states—not feelings, those are left-brain things, [but] feeling states like, “It feels warm, or soft,” or whatever. They don’t have boundaries, they don’t have angles, they don’t have dimensions. That’s why, the right brain—when you get there and you go into meditation, if you go deep enough, you actually experience dissolving yourself. You don’t exist, because that which thinks it exists is still the left brain. Your thoughts are not you, your feelings are not you. The only thing that really is you is this experience at the center of your heart, which is the eye in the vortex of the hurricane—which is one with all creation because it’s uncreated at that point. It’s potential.

The zero point field is called the zero point field in physics because there’s nothing there. You see, what is [there] is an infinite field of potential. And what the scientists say is there are ghost or virtual particles that are continually springing into being. But then they’re annihilated as [quickly] as they come into being because there are positive and negative charges, and the two cancel each other out. There’s matter and anti-matter, if you want to say that. So nothing really sticks, if you will, in that realm.

However, if you can take what Jesus said, and I don’t know if it was Jesus, but you take the idea or the intent, a tiny, tiny, tiny intent, smaller than the grain of a mustard seed. You drop that into that field from the field of your heart, that’s your communion point with the zero point field. What happens is it forms a little irritation in the field, then it creates a little eddy pool, like a tornado. And then there’s another vortex that’s magnetized to that, and then what you get—and this is the science of this—you get charge clusters.

So instead of having these virtual particles coming into being and then dissipating, they actually become stable within the geometry that’s defined by this field of energy that you’ve created with that little tiny seed of intent. Over—I wouldn’t even say the passage of time, [but] what happens is it reaches a certain potential, what you’d call a kindling string. It will then pop into manifestation where it [can] be observed, probably just at the quantum level, unless you’re very practiced at letting go of your distortions concerning what time and space’s existence is.

The quantum physicists, they got really weird. I know some guys, they wear really big shoes, some of them. Like size 13 shoes for size 10 feet, because they don’t want to fall through the cracks in the universe. So that’s a pretty altered state of consciousness. But they’re altered from actually dealing with this alternate perception of reality, which is based upon verifiable science. It just cannot be experienced by the left brain because the rules for how we observe are conscious rules.

We see what we see, we see what we expect to see, we experience what we know we can, and that’s why we don’t see miracles even if we pray for them or desire them or attempt to needle God for them. What we see is we see problems, because our left brain, [using] linear logic, [when] it has problems, it looks for solutions. That’s what it does. It’s a machine. Once you transcend the problem-solution set so that you’re all right with either one, you neutralize the charge upon that dynamic—call it yin/yang, call it good/evil, call it whatever you want. But you neutralize that, [and] you drop into your heart, which is mass-less, charge-less, space-less, dimension-less. You actually merge into that pool of oneness, and from that pool, again, you can drop the tiny seed of intent to see miracles. There we go.

TS: Now, Richard, right here, in this moment, I want to drop into the field of the heart. And I want your help here. Is this a geographic zone in my body? When we say the field of the heart, I imagine I’m going to my chest. So is that the correct motion?

RB: Well, going to your chest is correct, and what you want to do is go inside of your chest. But it’s a funny thing, because when you go inside, imagine a funnel that then collapses in on itself. So it goes from a certain, definable size to indefinable, and then it comes out on the other side, like you’re going through a wormhole into infiniteness.

Now, the key, the trick is really simple, and I found this out. You don’t need to meditate for years and years. All you have to do is ask an open-ended question. I learned this from Star Trek. James Kirk defeated the machine that was going to destroy the earth, or destroy the heavens, by just asking open-ended questions that a computer can’t answer. If you ask an open-ended question, without a charge, without an expectation or a need for a response, your right brain actually goes on a search for the perceptions that match that answer. Your left brain can’t answer it because it’s not a closed yes or no response, which is all it knows.

So here’s what you do: ask this question, “Where am I in related to the field of my heart?” Now, I’ll give you some more direction about this. When you ask that question—first thing, what Jesus said, or what somebody that might have been Jesus said, “Seek and you shall find, ask and you shall receive.” There is a trust element here that if you ask, you will receive an answer. The question becomes, do you have an altered enough perceptual state to perceive the answer when it occurs?

So here’s how you do it: Have you ever been walking down the street and you see something out of the corner of your eye? I’m sure you have.

TS: Sure, yes.

RB: OK, so the right brain functions that way. What it does is perceive far, far more than you’re ever allowed to actually notice. So if you suspend the rules for how you normally notice—what we call “notice what you notice,” notice what’s different, not what’s the same—you now have created an open rule set that says, “Whatever I perceive, I accept as useful.”

Now, when you ask, I want you to pretend—most people, they think they have trouble getting into their heart because they tell me they’re too left-brained. What I’ve found, out of hundreds and hundreds of seminars, [is] they’re not too left-brained. What we do when we’re looking for information, we actually go outside of our bodies, our awareness, in order to find where that information resides.

So [you ask], “Where am I in relation to the field of my heart,” and then pretend you’re looking up in the sky or just look up in the sky, like you’re looking for a kite that’s somewhere up there in the wind, maybe floating in the clouds. You’re going to find that there’s a part of you that’s somewhere out there. It’s like watching a ping pong match. If you watch a ping pong match going back and forth, you can only catch the movement out of the side of your eyes. It goes too fast for you to directly look at it. Same thing here.

By asking an open-ended question, seeking, believing you will get a response, you will get a sense of where you’re awareness is in relation to the field of your heart. Once you do that, all you need to do is to ask that part to come in the center of your chest. You can imagine shooting a grappling hook, for instance, out into the sky, where you perceive yourself to be. Latch on to that and the reel it in to the center of your chest. That’s really all there is to that.

The thing is, when you’re not paying attention, as soon as you lose your lock, if you will, on that state, it will float back out. You’ll either find yourself where you think you live, which is up in your head, or you’ll find yourself literally out of your body—the portion of you that thinks will be out looking for the information. Every time you have a thought, you actually have to seek where that information is and then find that and lock into it. Most of the information is not in our heads, it’s out in the morphic fields of consciousness. You can literally learn to read all knowledge if you could read these morphic fields. You could call it the Akashic Records.

So it takes practice. But it is very easy to do. Literally, we have hundreds of people every seminar that learn how to do this and learned how to do it very quickly. Once you do that, Tami, what you’re going to feel is like you’re both more in your body, but also more expanded at the same time. It’s a very strange sensation. It helps, initially, to close your eyes. Close your eyes, direct your awareness into the center of your chest, and what you’ll find is your awareness tends to float elsewhere. You can’t force this. It will not work—that’s your left brain trying to make something happen. You let go so that it does occur. It’s a natural state.

And when you do that, once you’re there, you’re going to sense [that] you’ve become spherical in your awareness, like you could almost see behind you without looking. Often people feel much taller as well, like they’ve gotten very, very tall and very expanded. At this point, many people will go completely unconscious, as you’ve seen personally. Or they will experience joy for no apparent reason. In other words, they could be in pain, they could have cancer, their lives could be a mess, they could have trouble with their finances, trouble with their whole lives, and all of a sudden they would find themselves laughing, not because something’s funny, but because there is such a release of joy and they don’t know why it’s there.

And once [you] contact that and learn to sustain that, that’s where you’re really starting to weave that personal field that responds to that little tiny seed of intent, [which] creates the miracles that become more and more apparent the more you do this exercise.

TS: Well, I actually think a miracle might be happening in our conversation, Richard. You know, I think when I try to understand you and your work, using I think what you would call my left brain, you know, it just bounces off, nothing really happens. And if anything, I get a little frustrated and I think, “Either he’s talking too fast, or I’m not smart enough,” or something. It just sort of like bounces off, nothing happens.

But in listening to you for the last 15 minutes and just having the experience of dropping into this center of the heart field, I actually feel connected to what you’re saying, and as you said, this spherical sense of being and joy. There’s a relaxation in me. I wonder if even to appreciate Matrix Energetics, one needs to approach the whole thing differently than we usually approach almost everything else we try to learn in our life.

RB: That’s why we call it a consciousness technology. We deliberately do not teach techniques in this seminar because if you teach a technique, your left brain will latch onto that and think it’s got it. It’ll learn to mimic like a chimpanzee, going through the steps. And you will be able to get some very good results, but you will not get the experience that’s at the core of Matrix Energetics, which is that heart technology that I did not invent. But I discovered how, over many years, to access this to get out of the way so the miracles, the changes in consciousness, the changes in people’s lives, and the quality of their experience becomes much more observable and reliable.

And it has taken me, as a scientist, essentially, to ask that open ended question over and over again and looking for the response. And then I learned it from being literally in seminars teaching, watching people, and then guiding them and having them notice what they found. Then they can access the state and they know they’ve got it. And we have such a success rate at this point in the seminar. I would say at least 98 percent of everybody attending gets to this state, understands it, and produces results.

TS: Now, there is something—you may not want to represent it as a technique, but [there is] this idea of something you call the Two-Point. And this is a basic approach that you teach people. Can you describe how doing the Two-Point relates to falling into the center of the heart?

RB: It doesn’t relate at all. In fact, what I’ve realized over the years is that the Two-Point’s kind of a trick. What it does is it allows your left brain to focus on something it can understand, observe, and measure, while the right brain integrates with the heart and performs the actual magic.

The Two-Point—what it does is it gives you a way, if you want to call yourself a scientist or a skeptic, to perceive the way something feels or what it is or how you experience it, to drop into the field of your heart, do what we call “uncollapse the wave function,” and then come back and remeasure and reexperience it as different. What this does over time is it builds a bridge between the left and right brain so that the two start to [shake hands] across the center. And you start to merge your consciousness so that your left brain cooperates with your right, and your right brain actually starts to be available to the perceptions of your left brain.

In other words, you are fundamentally changed in your consciousness, and I’ve heard this from many, many people. I have people tell me all the time [that] their lives were never the same after that seminar. They realized, A, they were far more than their body; B, they were not their thoughts or their emotions; and C, they didn’t need to actually do anything in order to achieve magnificent results. All they needed to do was step into that point in their heart and trust, and things would happen. And they could trust that, and they could go with the flow, and they felt like their lives were set free. And I think that is not anything you could describe as a technique, but there is a methodology, which is different.

TS: So describe the Two-Point methodology to me. I want to learn to do the Two-Point.

RB: Well, it’s really simple. When I first learned this, I was a chiropractor, and I’m very good at feeling things on bodies. So I would feel a point that felt stuck, hard, and rigid. You know, something that wasn’t moving in the spine or somewhere in the body, and I would touch that. It just feels—yuck. It’s like if you touch something and it feels nice, like the petals of a rose or something, you touch something else and you just don’t want to touch it. So there’s that feeling, there’s distress there somewhere.

Then, what I originally did was I looked for a point that caused that distress to feel like a magnet, like there were two places that matched. What happened then is when I would drop out—and at the time I didn’t have the technology of the heart—those Two-Points would collapse together or merge. And when they did, the pattern underneath that [I was] measuring was fundamentally different. That’s really as simply as I can put it.

But the real deal is there is no point to the Two-Point, and we tell people this in the seminar. After you’ve learned how to do this, you can let go of the training wheels, which is what the Two-Point is. And this is why I don’t like people trying to teach this, because they don’t know what they’re talking about. The Two-Point is a way to get away from the idea of the technique or methodology to become that. Once you become something, it doesn’t matter what you do.

TS: I’m comfortable, Richard, with getting some training wheels at this moment.

RB: Oh yes, training wheels are great, and we give [them] to everybody.

TS: So can you offer those—I want to make sure I understand. Let’s say right now I want to do a Two-Point on myself, I’ll just use a genuine example, because I have a headache. How would I do it?

RB: OK, great. So you know you have a headache. Where in your head is the headache? What part of your head, is it the whole head or just part of it?

TS: Just part of my head. The back of the head.

RB: OK. So without even touching—because you can do this without touching—I want you to find the center of that headache. Find the point that’s at the center of that headache.

TS: OK.

RB: OK? Now, what you want to do is find a second point. And it really doesn’t matter where. Find a second point. You’re creating a vector into that pattern. So say it’s your shoulder, or it could be a point in the air. I don’t care. But wherever it is—[and] this is important—feel a connection with that other point. Yes, that’s pretty good.

OK, hold that. Now, drop into your heart, and what’s you’re going to do is expand up and out, so that you let go. When you do this, you’ve entered into that interval between time and space, and it does not take long. Yes, that feels better. I can feel what you did. There’s more circulation rushing into the head area. There’s more flow in that area. I don’t know if your experience has changed or not, but my sense of what you experienced was you did very well with that.

TS: Yes. So you could do this Two-Point picking any area—find the center of pain, pick another point that’s not in pain, and then feel the way they connect?

RB: Yes. And the reason this works, Tami—what I original thought it was based on was quantum physics. Let me just [try to] break it down. You have a body. Your body is made of systems that we arbitrarily have delineated: brain, nervous system, blah, blah, blah. Then you’ve got organs that are components of those systems. Those organs are made of specialized organic tissues. The tissues are made of molecules. The molecules are made of atoms, and here’s where it gets dicey, because the atoms don’t exist.

The atoms have been found not to have an actual orbit, but to have a probability orbit. And when looked at under an electron microscope, an atom actually appears to [have] a tiny speck of dust, if you want to call it that, as the nucleus, and then this immense cloud, like an electron cloud, around the center. And what scientists believe is that’s all the possible position that electron could be in before what’s called the collapse of the wave function—before we observe it and cause it to appear where we expect it to be.

So it actually takes—the shortest distance between two points is a line. So in order to collapse the wave function, the act of observing or measuring is what is required. This is where the Two-Point came from. I was reading physics and I thought, “I’ll take my training, find two points, [and] move into this iimension-less quantum realm. And then I will release the measurement, let go”—drop down to this place of intent and let go is what we tell people—“I will let go and that will collapse it into a new possible outcome.”

Now, if you have a very mild intent for it to change—let’s say your headache. If you would like it to change but you’re not trying to make it change, a soft intent is enough to create that little nucleus where a new pattern can form around. If it’s too hard, what it does is it collapses it into the experience of what you’re observing. In other words, you’ll get no change because you’re looking so much for a change that you’ll miss the state that allows for the change. Just like what you felt. If you drop into your heart, you’ll feel the expansion, and you’ll also feel bigger, often, or otherworldly, plus more grounded, if you want to use that terrible word. I call it terrible because it has a lot of suppositions based around techniques and methodologies. But you’ll feel more present, I’ll just say that. And yet you’ll also feel more expanded.

So your potential has expanded. You’ve softened your awareness of the physical body. You’ve included non-physical aspects. That’s where the magic is. As I’ve explained, at your core, you don’t exist, because the atoms themselves are possibly there, or probably there, but only when you observe them to be so. This is why, when you’re in an altered state, you play with—and this is going to get a little dicey—Heisenberg’s uncertainty principle.

At the quantum level, here’s the way it works: You’ve got a particle called an electron. It’s got a defined place in space [so] that you could find it. And then it’s also got a momentum or velocity, how fast [it’s] moving. Here’s where it gets funny: At the quantum level, the more you attempt to determine where that exact position of that electron is, the more fuzzy your measurement of that electron [becomes] as far as its velocity goes. This is because the left brain can’t do two things at once. So if you go to measure the momentum or velocity of the particle, you will progressively lose definitive ability to measure its position in space.

When you do this simultaneously, like I just showed you, what happens is you’re collapsing this into, essentially, a non-particle state called a “wave state,” and hence people feel the wave, or we say collapse the wave. And in that point, when you’ve let go of the need for it to be in that pattern, it can, outside of your conscious awareness, reconfigure into a new outcome. And since all of you—that’s your physical, emotion, mental—is made of this indeterminate stuff, it doesn’t really exist, consciousness is what drives this as the observer.

Therefore, when you transcend the way you’re measuring your reality—you adopt a little game, like we just said, training wheels—it gives you a method to scientifically observe or determine that changes occur when you drop out of your left linear mindset. Over a very short period of time, this becomes a very natural state. We have participants that do this with absolutely everything. I would be one of them.

TS: Which actually is something I wanted to ask you about, doing this with absolutely everything. Do you find things in your life that are just sort of stuck things?

RB: Oh, absolutely. Just about everything.

TS: I mean, stuck aspects of your business, or stuck aspects of relationships. And you do some version of this, you know, dropping into the zero point field, [and] miracles are going to happen, but actually things still just kind of suck.

RB: They can. What I’ve noticed by doing this, you really can’t pretend to actually walk upon the need for it to change. You really actually have to do it. And what I’ve found when this happens—for instance, I’ll give you some examples. I’ve got a sixth lumbar, an extra vertebrae. I was also injured pretty badly bad in naturopathic school, to the point where I was nearly paralyzed in my spine for about six months, even though I still went to work and school. I have had constant pain there ever since I was about 11, [and] I’m going to be 58 in two weeks. I have a hernia, you know. I wear glasses, I dye my hair.

TS: You don’t have to tell me everything, Richard.

RB: Yes, those are just some examples.

TS: I’m joking with you.

RB: I’m going to leave out some of the things you don’t need to know.

TS: OK.

RB: There’s plenty, believe me. My point is this: I have changed those things by not changing them. I still have some of the things that I have, I still need glasses and so on, but I’m human. I don’t care. What I care about is the amazing life that I have. And I’m not talking about how much money I have, or how happy I am, or where I am in life. I’m talking about the very experience of life, as a moment-to-moment thing, has been transformed in such a way that I still can’t believe it. Every time Melissa and I get on stage, some part of us cannot conceive or believe what always happens. And these miracles, when they happen—and they do—are so far outside of our expectation set, you literally transcend your sense of self just by being in the presence of them.

So that’s what I would say. I mean, my life has been through some serious challenges in the last few years and is still going through a few. But I am still full of joy when I step on that stage because what we’re sharing is so undefinable, yet so real; so magical, yet so present, that it is a great and deep abiding honor to be its servant.

TS: OK, now we’ve mentioned the word “miracles” a couple times, and I did want you to enumerate for me—maybe just pick two miracles that you’ve seen happen—

RB: I’ll pick a ridiculous one that’ll knock your socks off. I still am shaking my head. I did not do this, the field did it. That’s what we tell people. We don’t do anything, the field is what is doing it. In the Bible it says, “The Father worketh and I worketh hitherto.” I think the Father is this field, and I think when you get to your heart, you’re getting that point of your real awareness and that is one with the Father, or one with that field.

So here’s the example that I want to give. It’s ridiculous. We were in a seminar somewhere, I don’t know where, and had a gentleman who was there with his wife. His wife was a practitioner, not in Matrix Energetics, but she was clairvoyant, she could see energy, she’d been working with healing her whole life. Her husband was none of that. Her husband was an auto mechanic. He was a foreign car specialist auto mechanic. He did not have any belief in anything I was saying, he had no reference for anything that was happening. He was not experiencing anything for himself, but in fact he was pretty much sitting with his arms crossed the whole day and tolerating me because he loves his wife.

So I got to know him. His name was Ray Hendrix—which, what a great name for somebody that loves the ‘60s and Jimi Hendrix. So the next day, there’s Ray, and we get up and Melissa and I are doing questions and answers. We will do this on Sundays and Mondays. So we’re starting the session, and before the mic can even be passed around for someone to ask us a question, Ray is jumping out of his chair. Now, he’s a little guy, and he is so animated, he’s like, “Richard, Richard, I’ve got to talk to you!” I said, “Yes, Ray. Yes, please, enlighten us, what’s going on?” He’s like, “Richard, something happened yesterday. I don’t understand it, and I just have to talk about it.”

Here’s what happened: He was outside at the end of the seminar. We’d gone through the Two-Point, we talked about the idea of time travel. He’s outside smoking a cigarette, and just kind of staying away from all the New Age freaks. And all of a sudden his cell phone rings. He picks it up, and it’s his best friend, who he hasn’t seen in over four years. His best friend is in the hospital with a brain tumor. It’s moved from his lungs—there’s that smoking thing—into his brain, and he’s got cannonball lesions, which are quite metastatic and serious, in his brain, and he’s going to die. And so he tells [Ray], “You know, I just wanted to call you and tell you I miss you, and tell you what’s going on, and I’m sorry I’m not going to be around much longer.”

Well, this made Ray very sad. He looks around, and no one was there. And so he held out his hand, he was holding his cell phone in the air, and the phone was kind of like a ruler. And he thought to himself, while looking guiltily around, “Four years ago, he was perfectly healthy.” And that’s all he did. He didn’t think it would work, he didn’t have any reason to expect anything—this is the key. And so then, about three hours later, apparently, his friend called him back. He said, “Ray, something happened. I feel so much better, I got out of bed, pulled my IVs out, I yelled and raised hell, and they did another CAT scan on my brain. The tumor’s completely gone.” This is hours later. He said, “I feel great. All my energy’s back. I’m not going to stay here, I’m checking out. They’re going crazy, but I’m leaving.” And then Ray used an expletive, he said, “What the blank happened there?” And I told Ray, “Look, Ray, I don’t know. But obviously you entered the state we were talking about and connected, because you didn’t need to and didn’t believe you could! Therefore you were neutral.”

So that was good, and he was a whole different man, there. But here’s the big miracle, here’s the really big one, I think: In our seminar, we found that we could teach people to “become clairvoyant” by teaching them how to play like children, how to learn how to trust the images that their right brain gives them, and how to expand upon those and follow them into an open-ended process to learn. And so Ray actually participated in that exercise. Melissa and I went upstairs for lunch. I came back down on this break, and Ray, this very skeptical, very curmudgeonly sort of fellow, he runs up to me. He’s got his hands open. He goes, “Richard, Richard, I’ve been looking everywhere for you! Here’s a pink dolphin, and he says he’s yours and he needs to talk to you!” And he handed this thing to me. That’s a miracle.

TS: [Laughs]

RB: That’s almost a bigger miracle than the brain tumor, because his life was completely different. He was crying at the end of it, he was leaping up and down for joy. It was ridiculous. And that stuff happens all the time.

TS: And it’s funny that you say that about the pink dolphin, because, of course, you started our conversation—I was asking you about what happened back in 1996 and you said, “Superman appeared.” And, of course, there’s something kind of ridiculous about this, that this whole series of discoveries began with a vision of Superman.

RB: Right.

TS: What do you make of that?

RB: I think that Superman was real. [Laughs] And I think that I saw something that was really there. You could call it a guide, or you could call it an expression of my unconscious as forming an archetype as a holographic reference for x-ray vision and healing. That’s what I think it really was. But it doesn’t matter. The real is the real. And what you experience, how you perceive it, is just as real as anything anyone else perceives. So [Ray’s] pink dolphin, when he found that, that was a big thing for him. And I could see what he handed me as well, and it was a little pink dolphin.

Again, you have to suspend the rules and become like a child. You can’t pretend to be a child, you have to become like a child to get into the state, and once you do, there is a whole inner world waiting for you that is beyond comprehension. I still can’t comprehend it, honestly. I still don’t understand it, I don’t know why it happens around me, through me, why I’ve been given the grace to teach others how to access this. And it still makes no sense, even now that there’s a lot of science behind it.

He was actually there—Claude Swanson, he’s a PhD, he has a physics degree from MIT and a physics degree from Princeton. And he talks quite a bit about me and Matrix Energetics in his new book, Life Force: The Scientific Basis. And he talks a lot about torsion fields, which he thinks the actual explanation for Matrix Energetics is, which I agree with. So it’s a funny, weird world, I’ll tell you.

TS: Well, and I have to say, Richard, that this is now the second chance I’ve had to interact with you. The first was when you came to Sounds True and you were doing some video recording here. And both times, it’s like a cosmic curveball. I have to say, you deliver a really fastly moving beautiful cosmic curveball, so thank you so much.

RB: Thank you so much. It’s a pleasure, because you know what? Here’s the thing: I have nothing to say and nothing in my mind unless someone listens to it. And it’s your desire to listen to that and to have that experience that creates it.

TS: Very good. I’ve been speaking with Richard Barlett. Richard Barlett has created, with Sounds True, a very interesting and powerful home study course. It’s called The Matrix Energetics Experience, and it includes a DVD of Matrix Energetics in action, with some seminar footage. It also includes an 87-page workbook, 6 audio sessions, and 41 cards that give you details on the properties of 21 fundamental frequencies, along with inspiration cards. A complete multimedia home study course on the Matrix Energetics experience. Richard, thanks again for being with us on Insights at the Edge.

RB: Thank you Tami, it was a great pleasure.

TS: SoundsTrue.com Many voices, one journey.