{"id":19448,"date":"2022-03-08T08:46:00","date_gmt":"2022-03-08T15:46:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/resources2.soundstrue.com\/?post_type=transcript&p=19448"},"modified":"2022-03-08T08:46:00","modified_gmt":"2022-03-08T15:46:00","slug":"our-evolutionary-leap","status":"publish","type":"transcript","link":"https:\/\/resources2.soundstrue.com\/transcript\/our-evolutionary-leap\/","title":{"rendered":"Our Evolutionary Leap"},"content":{"rendered":"
\"image_print\"Print Transcript<\/span><\/a><\/div>

Tami Simon:<\/b> Welcome to <\/span>Insights at the Edge<\/span><\/i>, produced by Sounds True. My name\u2019s Tami Simon, I\u2019m the founder of Sounds True. I\u2019d love to take a moment to introduce you to the new Sounds True Foundation. The Sounds True Foundation is dedicated to creating a wiser and kinder world by making transformational education widely available. We want everyone to have access to transformational tools such as mindfulness, emotional awareness and self-compassion, regardless of financial, social or physical challenges. The Sounds True Foundation is a nonprofit dedicated to providing these transformational tools to communities in need, including at-risk youth, prisoners, veterans, and those in developing countries. If you\u2019d like to learn more or feel inspired to become a supporter, please visit soundstruefoundation.org.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

In this episode of <\/span>Insights at the Edge<\/span><\/i>, my guest is Lynne Twist. Lynne Twist is a hugely accomplished global activist, author and teacher. She\u2019s an award-winning speaker who has devoted her life to sustainability and economic integrity. She is president and founder of the Soul of Money Institute and she\u2019s the cofounder, along with her husband, Bill, of the Pachamama Alliance, which works to preserve the rainforest by empowering the Indigenous people who are its natural custodians.<\/span><\/p>\n

Lynne Twist is the author of several books including <\/span>The Soul of Money<\/span><\/i>, and with Sounds True, an audio program on <\/span>Unleashing the Soul of Money<\/span><\/i>. Lynne Twist embodies the loving power of grandmother energy. A woman on purpose, a woman who gives, and gives so generously and with clarity, fierceness, and power. Here\u2019s my conversation with someone I really respect, Lynne Twist.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

I wanted to begin, Lynne, by sharing how it was a couple of years ago that I was at the Wisdom 2.0 event and you and I ran into each other. You said, very nonchalant, \u201cWhat\u2019s new, Tami? What are you working on?\u201d I said, \u201cWell, we\u2019re partnering with Wisdom 2.0 and LinkedIn to produce a new program called the <\/span>Inner MBA<\/span><\/i>. It\u2019s an online training on the wisdom skills needed in business today.\u201d<\/span><\/p>\n

You just looked at me and you said, \u201cCount me in. Whatever I can do to help, whatever I can do to support, I\u2019m in.\u201d I thought, first of all, what a gracious, generous human you are to just say something like that. How rare that is for someone to \u2026 Most people are protected or guarded and you were just like, \u201cCount me in.\u201d\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

OK, fast forward a couple years. I write to you and I say, \u201cWill you give the commencement address?\u201d Because, of course, I remembered your offer, \u201cWill you give the commencement address for our first graduating class of the <\/span>Inner MBA<\/span><\/i>?\u201d You said yes, again. There you were. Now this all leads up to our conversation today, because in that commencement address, you offered something to our graduates and to me, and I thought it was so helpful. I want to bring that now to the listeners of <\/span>Insights at the Edge<\/span><\/i>. What you did was you located us in time, this time that we\u2019re in. That\u2019s the way I felt. I felt like in talking to Lynne Twist, there was this cosmic GPS that came in and said, \u201cHere\u2019s where we are. Here\u2019s where we are. As emerging business people wanting to make a difference, here\u2019s where we are as a human species at this time.\u201d Let\u2019s start there through the lens of Lynne Twist. Help us locate ourselves.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

Lynne Twist:<\/b> Wonderful. My goodness. Thank you, Tami. Well, let\u2019s see. I feel that it\u2019s helpful and I really got this from Buckminster Fuller, who I was so fortunate to know and study with and listen to quite a bit, how important it is to look at the continuum, the long continuum of time. It\u2019s very helpful because we get so involved in the petty pace of the daily needs that we forget that we\u2019re on this planet for a particular time and it\u2019s not an accident, I think, when we show up, how we show up in the long continuum. Anyway, I think of us now as in the first century of the third millennium.<\/span><\/p>\n

We just started the third millennium. We just passed the year 2000, and I know it\u2019s all an invented calendar, but never mind, let\u2019s locate ourselves in the beginning of the third millennium, only 21, 22 years into it and the first century of the third millennium. I love doing that because it also reminds me of the many, many, many prophecies that I\u2019ve been privy to or that have been shared with me by Indigenous people that I know or other people who carry prophecies. There are so many prophecies about this time.<\/span><\/p>\n

This first century in the third millennium is a time where there\u2019ve been many prophecies that talk about this time as being very, very important, very pivotal, very \u2026 Another what you might call \u201caxial age.\u201d I love thinking about that, because it\u2019s so tumultuous. It\u2019s so both exciting and scary and confusing and unprecedented and wonderful and awesome that if you put it in that much larger context, the contents starts to make a little more sense.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> Tell me a little bit about the prophecies that have been important to you.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT: <\/b>Well, there\u2019s a very powerful prophecy of The Eagle and the Condor, and there\u2019s many interpretations of that. It\u2019s an oral tradition from North America and South American Indigenous people. Many of the South American people, the Quechua people in the Andes, talk about the prophecy in a particular way that it\u2019s the end of one Pachakuti. A Pachakuti is a 500-year cycle. It\u2019s the end of the fourth Pachakuti and the beginning of the fifth Pachakuti, the next 500-year cycle. The last Pachakuti, the 500-year cycle that we\u2019re just completing, began right around year 1500. Some people would remember the year 1492, it rings a bell, because the 500-year Pachakuti they\u2019re talking about is the 500 years since the conquest.<\/span><\/p>\n

They call it the Pachakuti of dominance and darkness, the Indigenous peoples of the Andes, and that we\u2019re moving out of\u2014the Pachakuti of dominance and darkness\u2014500 years of oppression and dominance. Certainly they felt that, but the patriarchy, you could say, in other ways of looking at it, into the Pachakuti of balance and light, which is the next 500 years. That\u2019s the fifth Pachakuti. But in between the fourth and the fifth Pachakuti, the prophecy says between those, in that transition space, there\u2019ll be 25 to 50 years of huge climactic events. This has been prophesied for millennia. Tsunamis, floods, fires, earthquakes, massive climactic changes that will humble all her creatures. Mother Earth, they call her Pachamama.<\/span><\/p>\n

Pachamama will humble all her creatures for 25 to 50 years so they remember their rightful role in relationship with her as we go into the Pachakuti of balance and light. That prophecy has been told for a long, long time about this time, and that the prophecy says the Pachakuti of balance and light will be when the mind and the heart of our species, the human species, will remember that it\u2019s one, and that for the last 500 years, the mind and heart of the human species have been separated, have been truncated, have lost each other. That\u2019s one prophecy that I find very, very compelling. Then should I go to another one?<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> Yeah, sure. These are terrific, please.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> Another one is called The Bird of Humanity. The bird of humanity comes from the Baha\u2019i people and it\u2019s also been validated and affirmed and comes through the Cherokee people as well. It says that the bird of humanity has two great wings, a male wing and a female wing. The male wing has been fully extended and fully fleshed out and fully strong and fully expressed for hundreds and hundreds of years. But the female wing of the bird of humanity has been folded in, not quite fully extended, not quite fully expressed for hundreds of years.<\/span><\/p>\n

The male wing of the bird of humanity has had to become over muscular, overdeveloped, and ultimately, has had to become violent to keep the bird of humanity afloat. And therefore we\u2019ve been flying in circles for hundreds and hundreds of years. This is the century, the first century of the third millennium, when the feminine wing, the female wing in all of us will fully extend itself, fully express itself in women and men, and the male wing will begin to relax and the bird of humanity, for the first time, will soar. I love that prophecy. It\u2019s very, very hopeful.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> Now, just to take a moment here because I think when we look outside in the culture we can say all kinds of things about, will we actually merge into an age of balance and light or not? But I\u2019m interested for a moment, Lynne, just in you. You as a person and how the mind and the heart and the masculine and the feminine are coming together in your own experience, and what that alchemy is like for you as an individual.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> Oh, Tami, you\u2019re such a good interviewer. You\u2019re so good. Well, it\u2019s a huge thing in my life. I have named, along with many other people, but I\u2019m one of them, named this century the Sophia Century. The century when women will take our rightful role in co-equal partnership with men and the world will come into balance. The Sophia, as you know, refers to divine wisdom, particularly divine feminine wisdom. And I find in my own life, in my own heart, in my own body, I feel much more room, space, freedom to express the divine feminine wisdom that I\u2019m caring, that all people are caring.<\/span><\/p>\n

Men are caring too, but women in particular. I find it in my relationship with my husband, Bill. He\u2019s a business guy, he\u2019s a dealmaker, a super athlete. But in 1994, \u201895, \u201896 when we cofounded the Pachamama Alliance, he left his business career behind and he became the CEO of what most people would call an NGO. He became much more accessible to his heart and his longing to make a difference with his life rather than doing deals, creating financial wins. He joined me in the work of the Pachamama Alliance that he cofounded with me, and he\u2019s the CEO of it. He\u2019s in Ecuador right now with Indigenous people.<\/span><\/p>\n

I find it in my relationship with my children, and particularly my grandchildren, because\u2014I\u2019m going to reference Arkan Lushwala, another wonderful Indigenous person who carries prophecies in ancient wisdom. He has declared that this is the time when grandmother energy is the energy that will carry us through the wormhole we\u2019re in, that it\u2019s grandmother energy. Everybody knows what that means. When you think about grandmother energy, it\u2019s different than mother energy, but it has a lot of that in it. That grandmother energy is steeped in wisdom and letting go and experience as well as care and love and holding.<\/span><\/p>\n

Grandmother energy is available to everybody too. You don\u2019t have to be a certain age or a certain sex. I can feel and I am a grandmother. I have grandchildren now, and I can feel the depth of grandmother energy in my body. I just took two of my granddaughters to the Amazon and we sat under what\u2019s called a mother tree in the Amazon, one of the huge kapok trees. I can\u2019t tell you, I\u2019ll start crying if I talk about it. Sitting there with them in the forest, in the Amazon rainforest, in the heart of the world, in the sacred headwaters of the Amazon, sitting under the kapok tree, the holy tree for the Achuar people, the Indigenous people who we were visiting, sitting there with them.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

I got a huge download of … What is it? Well, love, but not love. I can articulate obviously, enormous power. The enormous power of love from the forest, from the earth, from the trees. And obviously I love my granddaughters, but it\u2019s way a million billion times what the love that any grandmother feels for her granddaughters. The love for life and that it is the love for life that will allow us to flourish, not just survive, but flourish out of whatever\u2019s going on right now that\u2019s testing us.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

That will allow us to hear and receive and know and take in the feedback from the mother, which is climate change, which is the pandemic, I think. Huge feedback to our species that if we can, rather than operate out of fear as we go forward, operate out a kind of love that is so strong, so unshakable, and so deep that there is nothing more powerful than that love for life. Sorry about that. Just lost it there, but maybe I found it there. That\u2019s the personal experience of the feminine coming through me, the divine appointment that my appointment is lifetime, and I\u2019d say your appointment, it is lifetime, that I think we\u2019re all being tested to discover, connect within, fully express.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> You know, Lynne, I\u2019m glad we got right into it. When I experienced you offering this commencement blessing, I had a moment and I was like, \u201cI wonder what\u2019s going on inside of Lynne Twist. Not her ideas, which are brilliant, not all of the things she\u2019s accomplished, which would take me the full hour just to name them, not even great stories. But I was like, something is happening inside at a frequency level\u2014I don\u2019t know what other word to use. A feeling level. I was like, that\u2019s the thing I really want to know more about, and how you\u2019ve made yourself available to feel that and to have that come through you. I wonder if you could share more of the inner availability that you have for that love and grandmother power to come through.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> Well, the real answers is I don\u2019t know. That\u2019s the truth. I\u2019ve always been an open person. I don\u2019t value privacy or the things that many other people really crave and treasure. And I respect that, but my house is open, my home is open, my heart is open, my life is open. I\u2019m an open book. I don\u2019t have anything that I\u2019m hopefully hiding. Or maybe there\u2019s something there, but I don\u2019t even know myself. But one of the greatest gifts that I\u2019ve received \u2026 I did have the great privilege of working with Mother Teresa when I was a young woman in The Hunger Project.<\/span><\/p>\n

You can\u2019t get more better and more real teachings about love than being in the presence of a living saint like Mother Teresa. In fact, her in particular. I have had, in my life, with The Hunger Project, the opportunity to sit in ceremony with women and the \u2026 After their children starved to death in the great famine in Ethiopia in 1984, 1985, and sit with them as they mourned and wailed over the death of their children to starvation. You can\u2019t find a place in your heart deeper than wailing with a mother who\u2019s lost her child to something so horrendous as starving to death at her breast. A baby dying at her breast.<\/span><\/p>\n

I\u2019ve seen the depths of despair up close and personal, and I\u2019ve had the joy and thrill of being a woman who\u2019s walked in the world and had the privilege of making a difference with her life. Then most recently, it\u2019s not that recent, 25 years, 27 years working in the Amazon rainforest and really opening my capacity to love to the community of life. When I say that I mean insects, worms, vines, leaves, fungus, the extraordinary beings in the forest. I was recently with extraordinary shaman named Manari Ushigua in the last couple years, walking behind him in the forest of the Zapara people in the Sacred Headwaters of the Amazon. He had his machete and he was cutting a trail.<\/span><\/p>\n

He was cutting a way through for himself and for me, and he was barefoot and bare chested. I had all my equipment on to keep myself in the bugs and all this stuff, high boots and long sleeves and mosquito repellent. At a certain point walking behind him \u2026 We were alone. No one else was there behind us and he was taking me through the forest and showing me something. At a certain moment, he stopped and he turned around and said, \u201cCan you feel them?\u201d I said, \u201cWhat are you talking about? What do you mean? What do you mean?\u201d He said, \u201cStop. Can you feel them?\u201d I just stopped and listened and tried to see what he meant. Then he said, \u201cThe millions and millions of skulls.\u201d<\/span><\/p>\n

In that instant they were there. The souls of the butterflies, the souls of the snakes, the souls of the monkeys, the souls of the trees, the souls of the leaves, the souls of the insects, the souls of the leafcutter ants. Suddenly, they all had souls and I could feel them. I could feel them as a part of me. That\u2019s another thing that will bring me to tears, because I had never ever thought of it that way and I\u2019d been working in the forest for years. Had a relationship with the trees, yes, as beings, but not everything.<\/span><\/p>\n

Since that moment, I now have a love relationship, I\u2019ll say, with the natural world, the community of life, and of course, the great mother herself. To expand the capacity of my heart to love like that has been monumental, game changing. I don\u2019t know words, but\u2014and given me much more access to using the taproot of love to do the work that I do, which has always been where I came from, hopefully, but now it\u2019s so much more vast and so much more infinite, and it probably was always there, but now I know that.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> OK, I\u2019m going to have to go in even more with a magnifying glass. It\u2019s OK. Because when I hear you say that you could feel the souls, the souls of the insect, the butterflies, the worms, everything that was in the forest, I have my own imagination of what that might be like, but I want to actually know what it was like in your experience when you say you could feel the souls. What does that mean? Like a vibration or what? If you could describe it to me.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> Well, it\u2019s like when you\u2019re so moved about something that you disappear. When you\u2019re witnessing a sunset and it\u2019s so breathtaking, or the birth of a child that, in a way, you\u2019re not there, you are there, you\u2019re not there. Your identity dissolves. You\u2019re, what some people would call, ego is \u2026 I don\u2019t think it ever goes away completely, but I didn\u2019t have it at that moment. My identity, my Lynne-ness was gone and I was the souls of the creatures that were around me. People have this experience in when they take, sometimes ayahuasca, which we participate with, or they take one of these mind-altering substances that, as you dissolve your identity \u2026 I don\u2019t want to liken it to that because I\u2019m not sure it is. Well, it was like that. Like that.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> OK, good. That\u2019s that\u2019s helpful. Now, you mentioned that you\u2019re calling this century the Sophia Century and you also talked about your marriage with your husband. You\u2019ve been married, what? 50-some-odd years and describing how, when you first came together, it sounded like it was perhaps more of a traditional marriage, but how it\u2019s evolved over the last five-plus decades. I\u2019m curious what inner work you had to do to claim your full Sophia power in your life that could be helpful to other women who are in a process of that, taking a stand in their own Sophia power. What are the breakthroughs you have to be willing to take this or that on inside yourself?<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> Oh, wow. Gosh, Tami. Well, I just finished a book called <\/span>Living a Committed Life: Finding Freedom and Fulfillment in a Purpose Larger than Yourself<\/span><\/i>. That\u2019s my path. Maybe it\u2019s not for everybody, but it\u2019s my path. So many people do such beautiful inner work as Buddhists, or their meditation practice is something they love so much. I didn\u2019t start there. I started with making a difference with my life, really, and committing myself to ending world hunger, which, when we made that commitment way back in 1977, it was totally impossible. And yet taking on the impossible shapes you into the person you need to be to fulfill it.<\/span><\/p>\n

In other words, my path has been the purpose way larger than myself, something I could never accomplish in my own lifetime, perhaps, or I could never accomplish alone, has shaped me into the kind of person who could maybe even do that. That\u2019s a funny answer to your question, because you\u2019re asking about my inner life and I\u2019m talking about something out there kind of. But I really mean to say that the way I \u2026 My past to transformation came from Buckminster Fuller and his commitment to create a world that works for everyone with no one, nothing left out.<\/span><\/p>\n

Whether he first said that sentence or not, when he first said it. When I first heard it\u2014he probably said it many times, creating a world that works for everyone with no one and nothing left out\u2014my whole body went into a [inaudible]. Or I couldn\u2019t\u2014it was vibrating. I realized that\u2019s why I\u2019m born. I want to do that. I want to be that. Being that kind of a commitment, being the commitment to end world hunger. Now, the way we talk about Pachamama Alliance to bring forth an environmentally, sustainable, spiritual, fulfilling, socially just human presence on this planet\u2014that\u2019s a commitment that makes my heart full.<\/span><\/p>\n

I would say that I\u2019ve been shaped by my commitments that are larger than my own life. That has put my petty concerns about whether I look good or whether people like me way in the background. I still have those little thoughts, but they\u2019re not in the foreground. They\u2019re not bothering me so much, because I\u2019m up to something. I\u2019m up to something way larger than I can accomplish unless I surrender to be used, to become an instrument of my commitment, to become a channel for what wants to happen. That has homeschooled me, as Paul Hawken says. That has shaped me into a person who\u2019s more capable than I thought I could ever be. I do meditate and I do pray and I do take care of myself and I do love work, but my path has been more about through the power of commitment.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> Yes, and what\u2019s so interesting to me, Lynne, I just want to underline it for a moment, is here you heard this lecture by Buckminster Fuller in the 1970s, at some point in San Francisco, as a young person and that it could have that huge of an influence on you. Something he said\u2014the whole course of your life changed. I think the reason that\u2019s so important to me is sometimes I think about all the podcasts I\u2019ve done, all the programs Sounds True\u2019s put out, and I just think, God, if there\u2019s a few sentences out there, if there\u2019s something in this conversation that has anything, even 10 percent of that impact on somebody, it can be such a big deal. I just wonder what your thoughts are about that as someone who goes out and talks and gives so many presentations.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> Well, I hope that some of the things that I say, which mostly I\u2019ve heard from other\u00a0 wonderful humans like you and your wonderful podcast, have done that for others. People write to me and say to me, yes, that is the case. I was just on a podcast. I don\u2019t know if I can call it a podcast, but the thing yesterday, <\/span>Humanity Rising<\/span><\/i>, Jim Garrison\u2019s wonderful things he does every single morning, for this was 401. I was on the very first <\/span>Humanity Rising <\/span><\/i>broadcast, and I was on the one yesterday, which was number 401, and Charles Eisenstein, we were on together. And we had a conversation and there were other wonderful, amazing people on there.<\/span><\/p>\n

One of the things that we were talking about was endangered species\u2014that was the week of endangered species conversations\u2014and Thursday was about the endangered species he called us, humans. At one part of the conversation, we talked about this thing, about surviving, that will our species survive our own extinction? We realized that surviving is not the goal, actually. That\u2019s an inaccurate goal, because we could survive in bubbles or have some weird mechanical future that has us survive. It\u2019s not the right goal. The goal is flourishing, thriving as a species that is a contribution, like Thomas Berry said, \u201ca mutually enhancing human-earth relationship,\u201d where we are contributing to the community of life, where we are nourishing ourselves and we are flourishing.<\/span><\/p>\n

That conversation had a huge impact on me, and then I got hundreds of responses. It wasn\u2019t like I said it, or Charles said it, it was in our conversation. It wanted to be said. What I want to acknowledge is that you, Tami, create environments, ecosystems, for what wants to be said by Paul Hawken, by me, by you, by Marianne Williamson, by the people you interview, the people who show up. This is a time and a place, and it\u2019s probably always been true, that what wants to be said needs to come through. When it does, it comes through maybe you or me, but it does change the trajectory. I\u2019ll never forget when Buckminster Fuller sat at my dinner table with my children.<\/span><\/p>\n

We had him for dinner and my daughter was eight and she said this amazing, profound, insightful child comment. Bucky turned to Bill, my husband and I, and he said, \u201cNever forget that your children are your elders in universe time. They\u2019ve come into a more complete, more evolved universe than you\u2019ll ever understand except through their eyes.\u201d That sentence had such an impact on me as a parent. Every time I get a chance like this now, I share that with people and it has huge impact on people\u2019s capacity to parent in a new way, in a way that allows their children to be wise, and to be evolved, and to be people that they learn from. That\u2019s an example, and I know that\u2019s what your life is about, and mine too.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> Well, let\u2019s keep delivering here, Lynne, and opening the channel, which as you said, that this first 25 to 50 years has been prophesied as a time of great disruption, but we have the opportunity, at the end, to move into a period of balance. May it be so, God willing. My question to you would be, what do you think is required, is being asked of us, how are we being called now to be participants so that in the second half of this Sophia Century, we can have balance and light and not the disruption we\u2019re experiencing right now?<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT: <\/b>Well, I think if people are willing and open, like the people probably listening to this podcast are, to live in that context, then the choices, then they know and can be accountable and responsible for, we can be accountable and responsible for\u2014that the choices we make, every day impact the future of life for the next 1,000 years. When you live with that consciousness, that awareness, it sounds like it might be a burden. However, it is actually the opposite. It ennobles your life. You realize how powerfully you can live in a way that makes a difference.<\/span><\/p>\n

To consciously make choices, to know that the impact of your choices really are not trivial, but they actually do, literally, impact the future of life for the next 1,000 years. Also, to know or to maybe I\u2019ll say assert, but I feel like I \u2026 This is in my inner knowing for me at least, that we\u2019re in an evolutionary leap, that as a species we\u2019ve come to a place, like all species do, in the evolution of species where they need to evolve or die and we are there. Thinking about ourselves as a species rather than a clan or a tribe or I\u2019m white or I\u2019m black or I\u2019m blue or I\u2019m green or I\u2019m a man or I\u2019m a woman or I\u2019m powerful or I\u2019m weak or I\u2019m poor or I\u2019m Republican or I\u2019m rich. All of those labels, to get rid of them.<\/span><\/p>\n

I wish on the television, they would not put the name of the person and then that they\u2019re a Republican or a Democrat. I wish they would just not put that on there, because you can\u2019t listen to who they are because you listen through a filter of some label. If we could get rid of all those labels and just listen to each other as human beings, be with each other as human beings, as we walk each other through the portal of the evolutionary leap, that maybe every one of us won\u2019t make it.<\/span><\/p>\n

But as a species, we need to take the leap and to figure out what is that in my life? What kind of a leap do I take that has me really not just get incrementally a little bit better and wiser and a little bit smarter, a little bit more disciplined, all the things that I want for myself, but really take an evolutionary leap? I think when I had that experience with Manari in the forest and I had this experience of the oneness of all living beings, that was the beginning for me of my evolutionary leap. Now, when I look for wisdom, I do go to your podcast, but I also go outside to the trees. I really have a relationship with them. It\u2019s not, you know, middle-age humor, weird. I get real, solid, powerful information.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> Can you give me an example of that?<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> Well, I\u2019m working with Suzanne Simard who I recommend\u2014<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> Oh, wow. Wonderful.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> \u2014invite on your podcast. She\u2019s just awesome.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> For our audience, she\u2019s the author of a book, <\/span>Finding the Mother Tree<\/span><\/i>, and a BC researcher, British Columbia researcher.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> Yes, she\u2019s a forest ecologist and she wrote <\/span>Finding the Mother Tree<\/span><\/i> and her Mother Tree TED Talk has millions and millions of views. She now, and I are very, very close colleagues in a project we\u2019re doing. She\u2019s educated me about how the mother trees download all kinds of wisdom through the mycorrhiza and funky network to the trees in the forest that they know are in some ways their children or nieces or nephews or cousins. There\u2019s a whole society. There\u2019s a whole communication system constantly going on.<\/span><\/p>\n

Now, once I\u2019ve read her book and become an advocate, a colleague, an ally of Suzanne\u2019s, Professor Simard\u2019s, I know that when I\u2019m confused or upset or lost or in a quandary, there\u2019s a tree that I\u2019ve chosen in the Presidio. I live next to the Presidio, it\u2019s like a three-minute walk from my house. If I go to that tree and put my hands on the trunk, it\u2019s a very large tree, and my heart next to the trunk in a certain place where I like to be with her, I come, I center, I feel, I somehow know. I don\u2019t get a specific answer to a question, I get in touch with the fact or the, let\u2019s say, energy of natural knowing. I come back to my house in my office and something shows up. That\u2019s a specific example.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> Yes. Interesting hearing you talk about our evolutionary leap and being part of it. What happened inside me was I thought this is a time for each of us to be bold in whatever way in our own life. To be people who can take an individual leap as part of the leap for our species. I wonder what you think about that.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT: <\/b>I think that\u2019s absolutely true. In fact, I advocate, wherever I can, for us to dream big now. Big, big, big. Another person I love is Dan Pallotta. You should have him on your thing if you haven\u2019t had him. He\u2019s awesome. Dan Pallotta has 10 million views in his TED Talk. He\u2019s a great friend of mine. He talks about how we\u2019re in this mess because we don\u2019t think big enough to tackle the problems that we have in a way that gives us the vision we need to tackle them.<\/span><\/p>\n

I\u2019ll say what everybody knows the quote from Lao Tzu: \u201cWhere there is no vision, the people perish.\u201d We need vision now, big vision, big vision. That\u2019s one of the things that I love to listen for and create wherever I can. That\u2019s why the Pachamama Alliance\u2019s mission is to bring forth an environmentally sustainable, spirituallt fulfilling, socially just human presence on this planet. I think that\u2019s how Paul Hawken has written <\/span>Regeneration<\/span><\/i>, we can end the climate crisis in one generation if we are committed to regeneration.<\/span><\/p>\n

Regeneration, to me, includes regenerating what it means to be human. I think the pandemic is morning sickness for a pregnant species. When you\u2019re pregnant and you don\u2019t know you\u2019re pregnant and you have morning sickness, you think you\u2019re sick. But when you find out you\u2019re pregnant, you can tolerate the illness that comes with pregnancy. You love throwing up in the morning, because you\u2019re going to have a baby. I think we\u2019re entering a burst canal and it might be a painful one, and the burst might be painful, but we\u2019re giving birth to a new kind of human being.<\/span><\/p>\n

If we\u2019re willing to allow that to come through us and to think really big about what kind of a world is the world, we really know we can co-create with evolution and keep that vision as powerful as the challenges and obstacles that we see between us and that vision. We\u2019ll get through these obstacles, we\u2019ll transform them. They will give us the strength to leap into that new vision and become the species we need to be to not only prevail, but flourish on this planet.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS: <\/b>Can you describe the new human being to me? What\u2019s the new human being like, perhaps in ways that are different? What are our new capacity or ways of being?<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT: <\/b>The new human being has access to all the capacities that we now consider to be \u201clesser than\u201d or perhaps suspect\u2014like intuition, like instinct, like spiritual power, like capacity to manifest, like understanding we have a divine appointment, like accessing the divine feminine, both for men and women. That all of those capacities, those extraordinary, we call them, because we think they\u2019re not available to everyone, except they are, those capacities have as much credibility and clout as strategic planning, as being good at numbers, as being a great athlete, as what we\u2019ve defined, in the patriarchy, as the high bars that are what we call success.<\/span><\/p>\n

That these other qualities\u2014that are often demoted to \u201clesser than,\u201d or we\u2019re not so sure about them, or they\u2019re too woo-woo\u2014that they get the same clout, reputation, respect by all of us, including myself, and we access them the way you access the talent of a good masseuse or an extraordinary accountant, someone who\u2019s excellent with numbers. That we realize these are talents and treasures and that everybody has them. Some people have a little bit more of this and a little bit less of that, but we all have them and we need all of that.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

They all become available, accessible, and they have respect. They have our respect and there\u2019s room for them to be fully self-expressed and not doubted, and that we use them. Our relationship with astrology, our relationship with the enneagram, things that are sidelined. I think all of that is part of the divine feminine expression. It has enormous power that\u2019s so untapped in today\u2019s world. When we unleash it, that\u2019s a whole nother human being. That\u2019s a whole nother human being.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> Now, Lynne, I want to track back for a moment. You mentioned this speech you heard from Buckminster Fuller about how we can create a world where there\u2019s enough for everyone. In your book, <\/span>The Soul of Money<\/span><\/i>, there\u2019s a great deal, a very intelligent attention that you put on this whole notion of living from a sense of sufficiency, there\u2019s enough versus a sense of scarcity. Here is the question I have for you. I\u2019m going to be a vulnerable here, which is, I think a lot people, myself included, we feel that sense of sufficiency at certain times.<\/span><\/p>\n

Walking through a forest, being with the tree, at certain moments where we feel peaceful. But there are other times when that feeling of scarcity comes up. It\u2019s different for different people, for different reasons. For some on people, it has to do with financial pressures that they feel on their life, or some lack of love. Someone might feel, in their relationships, something like that. My question to you is, when we notice that feeling of scarcity come up, like we\u2019re committed to this other way of being, and we know it, but there are still these moments where that\u2019s not our actual experience. What do you recommend?<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT: <\/b>Well, the sufficiency principle I\u2019ll say that I, and it\u2019s in a framework called <\/span>The Soul of Money<\/span><\/i>, that the capitalist system, the commercialization of everything, the commoditization of everything, the consumer society has so overtaken everything\u2014I\u2019m going to say this is a preamble to answering your question\u2014that we think we live in an economic system that\u2019s taken over the ecological system rather than the economy is a subset of the ecology. Eco-eco.<\/span><\/p>\n

We\u2019ve made our home the economy rather than the ecology. Eco means home. We need to reclaim our home in the ecological world, and then we can have an economic system, but it needs to be consistent with the laws, the natural laws of the ecological systems. But we have done something very different. We\u2019re living in the economic system, which is based on scarcity. The whole book is really pointing to that our psychology, our philosophy, our education, our religion, everything is based on the economic scarcity model. That\u2019s false, because we do have enough for everyone everywhere to have a healthy, productive life.<\/span><\/p>\n

But we behave as if we don\u2019t. We hoard so much that we leave out millions and millions of people. We generate the world of scarcity when it isn\u2019t a world of scarcity. OK. Now, back up about personally. We personally have bought in, I think, all of us in an unconscious, unexamined way, the belief that there\u2019s not enough time, there\u2019s not enough love, there\u2019s not enough sex, there\u2019s not enough money, there\u2019s not enough square feet in my house, there\u2019s not enough this, there\u2019s not enough that. But it\u2019s almost like a siren song of a consumer culture, there\u2019s not enough and I\u2019ve got to have more.<\/span><\/p>\n

That\u2019s what I want to free people of, because there are those moments, as you described, when you know you are enough, there is enough, but then in a minute it\u2019s gone because of advertising and marketing. This economic system has taken over everything. For me, the principle of sufficiency, and then I\u2019ll see if I can be more personal in answering your question, is to let go of trying to get more of what you don\u2019t really need. It\u2019s hard to distinguish that in a world that wants you to get more of everything. If you let go of trying to get more of what you don\u2019t really need, it frees up all the energy that\u2019s tied up in the mythology of that chase, that franticness, to turn and pay attention to what you have.<\/span><\/p>\n

When you pay attention to what you have, it expands. Just like when you stop trying to scramble and get more time and pay attention to this moment, this moment, and be totally present, it expands before your very eyes. That principle, the principle of sufficiency, is really about presence. It\u2019s really about being with what you already have and knowing that it\u2019s yours to be with, and then to share. To share. When we share what we already have, our experience of what we have expands. Even though it may seem like, well, you have less of that. No.<\/span><\/p>\n

When you share what you already have, it expands before your very eyes, it expands in your experience. If you have financial problems, and I work with people who do, of course, ni the Soul of Money Institute. If you start to really look and see what you have and make a real difference with what you have, and begin to share it in a way that\u2019s consistent with your own integrity, it starts to grow in the nourishment of that intention. In reality, I\u2019m not really talking about an amount, but actually amounts actually do grow as well. This wonderful phrase that you\u2019ve heard me say a million times, but I\u2019ll say it again: what we appreciate truly does appreciate.<\/span><\/p>\n

It really does work that way. Even in time, sex, money, possessions, it really does work that way, if we can free ourselves from the mania of the scarcity mindset. Now, I want to just acknowledge there are people who need more money, more water, more access to food, more jobs, more housing. I\u2019m not talking about those situations, I\u2019m talking about the unexamined mindset that haunts all of us, especially those of us who do have what we need, and has us clamoring for more all the time, which generates a world where those who really truly do not have enough can\u2019t get access to anything, because those of us who do have enough are always trying to get more.<\/span><\/p>\n

As Gandhi said, \u201cThere\u2019s enough for our need, but not for our greed.\u201d If we can shift from our wants, and it doesn\u2019t mean we shouldn\u2019t want stuff. I want things. I would love to have a Tesla, etcetera, but I don\u2019t need one. But I\u2019d love to have one. That\u2019s OK. I\u2019m talking about something else and I know you do get it, but I\u2019m just trying to be articulate enough to let people know you can free yourself from that mania by just stepping out of the consumer culture for a moment. Paying attention to what you already have, seeing how you can share it, whether it\u2019s time or money or possessions, more generously. That actually is the source of recognizing and living and dwelling in the truth, what I call the radical pricing, surprising truth of the space of sufficiency.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> The very first move you made, it was so powerful that I want to highlight it, how to separate our ecological embeddedness from a kind of economic trance. I wonder if you can say more how to view money and economics when you\u2019re no longer caught in the consumer brainwashing around it. But instead you\u2019re like, \u201cOh, I\u2019m an expression and part of the earth, and this is a financial system that\u2019s over there.\u201d How that shifts things.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> We are living in a world where marketing, advertising, and even for this podcast, will probably be little interruptions of, I don\u2019t know if there will be advertising, but you can hardly listen to anything without it getting interrupted with some blaring advertisement about something. It\u2019s very, very hard to do what I\u2019m about to say. But I\u2019ll just say that the experience of really being connected to our home, eco, the ecological miracle that we are an expression of\u2014we don\u2019t live on the earth, we are of the earth. That\u2019s where we came from. That we are part of all of that, gets blocked and truncated and disrupted by this huge monster, the economy.<\/span><\/p>\n

All economy is not bad, but the economic system is so rooted in scarcity and there\u2019s not enough, and more is better, that we get caught in that in every aspect of our lives. To free ourselves from that is pretty hard. But I was going to just tell a little baby story. I was asked to do a TED Talk on Wall Street. I thought Wall Street? I\u2019m not an investment manager. I didn\u2019t go to business school. I\u2019m not a billionaire, I wrote a book called <\/span>The Soul of Money<\/span><\/i>, but it\u2019s not really a Wall Street kind of book.<\/span><\/p>\n

But some guy, who was doing a TED thing on Wall Street, said, \u201cWe should have her. She\u2019d be an interesting change.\u201d I remember I got up there and there was an audience. It was an early TED Talk before there were a lot of controls over how you do a TED Talk. I just got up there and started talking. I looked out on it, all 500 people. It was in the board of trade. It was in where people trade. What\u2019s it called? That place where you can ring the bell. It was there.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS: <\/b>Yeah. On the floor of the trading. The trading floor. Yeah. OK.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT: <\/b>They have a little auditorium there. It was there where all those people yell and scream at each other. It was in the auditorium and they were almost all men. I stood in front of them, and I said, \u201cI only have so many minutes here, but I want to leave you with a thought. Perhaps the economic system is a subset of the ecological system in which we live. Just imagine that. That it\u2019s merely a subset of the ecological system in which we live. Rather than the economy is about taking the ecology and turning it into money. Maybe it\u2019s the other way around. Maybe, and I want to suggest you think about this, that the fact that we even have an economy is given to us by the extraordinary generosity, the infinite bounty of the ecology. The economy is an opportunity to be economical with how we use the gifts of that extraordinary ecological system.\u201d<\/span><\/p>\n

I remember it was like \u2026 People were like [LAUGHTER]. But at the same time, I got unbelievable response from that talk. I\u2019ll just say that there\u2019s a way of living where we realize that everything, the computer on which I am speaking to you, the microphone that makes this technology possible, is from the earth.<\/span><\/p>\n

These are medals from the earth. We have so mined and extracted the things that we love so much from the earth that we now have this enormous power to now really, really give back to her, in not only equal measure, but in enormous bounty. How can one live in a way that\u2019s what you\u2019re in touch with. The enormous bounty that we have the opportunity to return to her. That\u2019s different than living in scarcity and trying to figure out how many more square feet of your house can you put on in the next year and who are you going to get as a contractor and how much do you need to pay them? All of that is practical.<\/span><\/p>\n

Yes, we need to do that. But can we do that in a way we are regenerating life. Paul Hawken, at the end of his book and also on his website, and I know you know this probably as well as I do, says, \u201cThere\u2019s questions to ask yourself before you take any action. Is this going to regenerate life or degenerate life? Is this going to steal from future generations or heal that which we want to give to future generations?\u201d There\u2019s a whole list of questions that you ask yourself before you make any large expenditure or any large choice. It really is \u2026 It\u2019s beautiful. It makes you sing when you get to the bottom of a list and you make a choice, you feel so good about who you are. I think that\u2019s the way we can live now and it will make us happier people.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> OK. Lynne, just a couple final questions. You\u2019re clearly someone who\u2019s super on purpose. You said it yourself. You\u2019re on purpose. Your life has been filled. You and your husband, together, your life has been filled with a bigger sense of purpose and it\u2019s energized you so much throughout your lifetime and now in your grandmother years, and it\u2019s just gorgeous. What would you say though to that person who says, \u201cI wish I had more of that purpose in my life, but it doesn\u2019t seem to be appearing. I wish it were. I wish it was the case?\u201d<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> That\u2019s a great question because that\u2019s \u2026 I\u2019m just finishing my book and I want to do a different ending, and I think you\u2019re helping me with that. I think everybody who\u2019s been born during this time has a role to play. It\u2019s not a big role or a small role. There are no big roles or small roles. There\u2019s just your role. If you play it, you\u2019ll have the kind of life you dream of. How, what that role is, is by feeling. Feeling, not thinking. Feeling has gotten a second place to thinking. Thinking is wonderful, but feeling your body, your heart, your feeling energy is such an incredible compass.<\/span><\/p>\n

If you feel good, feel really deeply good, not just a little bit of a high, deeply good about your choices you\u2019re making, those are the right choices. If you do that, choosing what\u2019s yours to do will show up for you. You\u2019ll see a through line through your whole life. What did you care about on the playground when you were five, six, seven? Were you the kind of kid who was a bully or were you the kind of kid who picked the bright kid first, or did you take care of the kids that were left out? Where were your strengths? Where were your weaknesses? Where is your heart and soul?<\/span><\/p>\n

When you look back and see, what is the through line of goodness of heart, of truth, of moral integrity in my life? How can I take that forward in a way that creates my evolutionary leap? We do workshops that help people with that, and your podcasts help people with that. What I say to people, if you are willing to know that there is, you have a divine appointment, or you wouldn\u2019t be here. I just know that\u2019s true. I found mine. I was so lucky.<\/span><\/p>\n

Maybe I was just lucky, maybe I was just awake, but Buckminster Fuller helped me. Werner Earhart, his training helped me, podcasts like this helped me and I stay in the zone of the messaging that\u2019s coming through. That\u2019s helping us find our rightful role in relationship with a long-term future of life. We all have one. Stay in this stream, Tami\u2019s stream. Stay in the stream of awakening. Stay in the stream of wisdom. Stay in the stream of people who love, who care, and your dharma will find you. You don\u2019t need to find it, it will find you.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS: <\/b>It does seem though that you might need to be willing to take a risk of some kind. There might be some bravery required. Do you think so?<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> I think there\u2019s a lot of that involved. Bravery is one way of talking about it and another way is surrender, or you might say, not succumb, but surrender. There\u2019s this thing that I want to just say, you didn\u2019t really ask it, but modesty is the same as arrogance. It\u2019s just the flip side of arrogance. It\u2019s trying not to be arrogant. It\u2019s another form of arrogance. But if you tell the truth about who you are, really claim it, take a risk and jump on out there, what happens is humility, your humbled by the power of your own choice. You\u2019re humbled by the power of your own risk. You\u2019re humbled by the power of your own courage. Don\u2019t be modest, just go for it. Just go for it, and you will find your groove and you\u2019ll be humbled by your own power.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> Lynne Twist, I love your grandmother energy and the love and light that pours through you. Thank you so much. So, so much.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

LT:<\/b> I love you, Tami Simon, and the love and light that pour through you and all that you do. Thank you for being with me.<\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

TS:<\/b> I\u2019ve been speaking with Lynne Twist. With Sounds True, she has released an audio program called <\/span>Unleashing the Soul of Money<\/span><\/i>, and there\u2019s also an excerpt from that program that\u2019s available called \u201cMeditations on Money.\u201d Lynne, as well, was the commencement speaker at our very first graduating class of the <\/span>Inner MBA<\/span><\/i> program. It\u2019s a-nine-month virtual training program for people in business who want to lead with their soul\u2014I\u2019ll just say it\u2014all lit up and on fire to make a difference in the world. You can find out more at InnerMBAprogram.com.<\/span><\/p>\n

Thank you for listening to <\/span>Insights at the Edge<\/span><\/i>. You can read a full transcript of today\u2019s interview at SoundsTrue.com\/podcast. And if you\u2019re interested, hit the Subscribe button in your podcast app. And also, if you feel inspired, head to iTunes and leave <\/span>Insights at the Edge <\/span><\/i>a review. I love getting your feedback, being in connection with you, and learning how we can continue to evolve and improve our program. Working together, I believe we can create a kinder and wiser world. SoundsTrue.com: waking up the world.<\/span><\/p>\n","protected":false},"template":"","meta":{"_expiration-date-status":"","_expiration-date":0,"_expiration-date-type":"","_expiration-date-categories":[],"_expiration-date-options":[]},"class_list":["post-19448","transcript","type-transcript","status-publish","hentry"],"yoast_head":"\nOur Evolutionary Leap - Transcript | Sounds True<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"Read the full transcript from this Sounds True conversation with Our Evolutionary Leap. 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