Mark Nepo: Authentic Expression is Heart-Based

    —
November 13, 2019

“All my work is about devotion to the messy, magnificent human journey”

—Mark Nepo

Every day, we learn. We take in more of the new. And yet, we can only respond to situations based on what we know already. We rely on the old.

Mark Nepo seems to be asking about the space between. What does it mean to grow and change with grace? What does it mean to have faith in that process? And what does this have to do with writing and expression?

We are constantly tasked to face the unknown using tools that may have only worked for us in the past (and that is freaking scary).

I believe that asking questions is elemental to human nature. But, it is impossible to truly know any of the answers.

For Mark, there is no one right way forward. There is no way out of fear. There is only a sensibility that can be adopted: that is, the willingness to listen. 

In other words, there are no objectives. There are no end products. The “answer” is in letting go of resistance to what we know, have, and are.

That way, the invisible can make itself known.

WITNESSING

“How do we talk about the things that matter that you really can’t see?”

—Mark Nepo

The ephemeral connection between ourselves and the world of essence exists within our hearts. With this practice—this practice of inner trust, perhaps even surrender—we can begin to gesture at expressing the unsayable.

What’s clear about Mark Nepo is that he is first and foremost a writer. However, his ideas can be applied to any form of expression.

To bear witness in writing, Mark advises giving full attention to whatever is in front of you, then describing it in as much detail as possible. It’s important not to make it seem magnificent or assign it “a bunch of meaning.”

Don’t evaluate it.

We are the observers and not yet the translators.

There is another part to it. Look inward. Feel what is moving through you at that moment. “Paint” that feeling with words. Don’t judge. Don’t bother with meaning. This disposition is inherently freeing. 

In this state (and I fall in and out of it even as I write this), reality moves up to our eyes like a mirror. We can look at it and hear it, be part of it.

THE INVISIBLE WORLD

“You can’t see light except for what it illuminates. All the forces that hold us and support us are invisible”

—Mark Nepo

We name things all the time. We have to. It keeps chaos at bay.

But, naming things tends to keep us separate from them. That is this and I am this and you are there and I am here.

In his Insights at the Edge episode with Tami, Mark mentions that we are accustomed to listening in this way.

We immediately assign names, places, spaces, reasons, meaning and significance to everything we see and feel. We judge and assume (partly because it is efficient; partly because we are so used to doing it).

This is in stark contrast to the “essence of wholehearted presence, however and whenever that appears.”

IMMERSION

“The truth is, I barely understand half of what comes through me. The other half leads me”

—Mark Nepo

Immersion is a different kind of listening.

Rather than naming, one engages in a mutual conversation with the world. Discovery and creation unite as the byproduct of participation in oneness.

For Mark, immersion is a way to stop resisting our naturalness and be… whatever it is we were meant to be, as humans.

When he talks about “the things that matter,” what he seems to mean is the invisible world, “that which holds us together.” In immersion, we have the chance to interact with the invisible source of our unity.

Like the fiery and untouchable sun from which our individual experiences emanate.

WHOLEHEARTEDNESS

“It’s a gift that we can’t reach what we’re trying to say or what we see, because of all that it gives us”

—Mark Nepo

In his interview, Mark says to Tami about art-making, “What matters more is our wholeheartedness than whether we do it well.”

Tami’s response struck me. “I notice, as you offer that answer, there’s a part of me that really softens.”

Creation can be a meeting place. Rather than prescribing, you meet something somewhere, and then you embrace whatever happens. You accept what is present—and in return, you are accepted just as you are.

Wholeheartedness: letting go of expectation for the sake of the unsayable.

SELF-EXPRESSION

“Just because I write it doesn’t mean that I have the meaning of it all”

—Mark Nepo

As a writing teacher, I often tell my students that if they’re stuck, they may not be empty of ideas. In fact, they may be too full.

Creating space for the heart allows the bubbles to rise up. Like attracts like. We see what we see.

“If you’re not quite there, go back to the heart of whatever the expression is about, and get closer, and get stiller, and put your defenses down, and get closer. … Go back and have a more open heart, and see what comes then.”

Sometimes, it’s unpleasant.

Sometimes, it’s utterly nonsensical.

Poetry, as one possible example of this art, has long emptied itself of pragmatic purpose and precise meaning for the sake of beauty and potentiality.

You may end up with something that you don’t understand for years. You may just take that thing out later and realize what you meant. Authentic expression is not a product. It’s a message from you to you, from the universe to the universe.

And it is always miraculous.

Mark Nepo

Mark Nepo is a poet and philosopher who has taught in the fields of poetry and spirituality for over 40 years. A New York Times #1 bestselling author, he has published 21 books and recorded 14 audio projects. Mark has been interviewed several times by Oprah Winfrey as part of her Super Soul Sunday TV show, and was interviewed by Robin Roberts on Good Morning America. As a cancer survivor, Mark devotes his writing and teaching to the journey of inner transformation and the life of relationship. His work has been translated into more than 20 languages. For more, see marknepo.com.

Author photo © Brian Bankston

Listen to Tami Simon's in-depth audio podcast interviews with Mark Nepo:
Holding Nothing Back »
Becoming the Poem »
Writing Is Listening with Your Heart and Taking Notes »

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Mark Nepo: Age Like a Meteor

What if aging isn’t about decline, but about becoming brighter—like a meteor that grows more luminous even as it falls through the atmosphere?

Tami Simon speaks with beloved poet-philosopher Mark Nepo about his deeply moving new book, The Fifth Season: Creativity in the Second Half of Life. Drawing from Chinese wisdom traditions and his own journey through chronic pain and back surgery, Mark illuminates aging as the “heavenly pivot” (love that phrase) which is the transformative shift from living outwardly to inhabiting life from the inside out.

Join Mark and Tami for this episode to explore:

  • The meteor metaphor: how we grow brighter as our outer casing flakes away • “Entering time” versus moving through it—and why slowing down opens the eternal moment • The paradox of limitation: how loss simultaneously deepens and expands us • Breaking through to joy as the depth of being that holds all the waves • Why the heart, not the mind, must lead in the second half of life • Living with chronic pain and learning to let beauty in while suffering • The difference between being victims of life versus initiates into life • How grief changes everything and why we don’t get over it, we get under it • Being swift of heart—living without hesitation from the inside out

Mark’s wisdom arises from decades of spiritual practice, surviving cancer, and facing the inevitable losses that come with a long life—essential listening for anyone navigating aging, chronic pain, loss, or simply seeking to live more fully present to the life they have.

Listen now to discover how the second half of life can be your most luminous yet.

This conversation offers genuine transmission—not just concepts about awakening, but the palpable presence of realized teachers exploring the growing edge of spiritual understanding together. Originally aired on Sounds True One.

Mark Nepo: The Half-Life of Angels

How do we know our own authenticity? How can we return to our hearts when we find we’ve left them? As we evolve and change along our journey, how do we relate to the “former selves” in our past? In this podcast, Tami Simon and poet-philosopher Mark Nepo address these questions and more, as they discuss his creative process; his new book, The Half-Life of Angels; and how we can each touch the ever-present and wholly miraculous “spark of becoming” waiting to guide our lives. 

Tune in as Tami and Mark talk about the introspective nature of the creative process; the metaphor of the soul as an inlet; congruency; how the heart shatters but inevitably heals; becoming a student to the mystery of life; the meaning of the word “admit,” and the practice of return; seeing through the lens of the miraculous; the intersection of meditation and creativity; the art of re-visioning; how a commitment to truthfulness grows in concentric circles; living from the deep versus diving and coming back up; the shift from being driven to being drawn; impermanence and perseverance; how the life of expression is one of discovery, relationship, and inquiry; why “there’s always a teacher next to you”; “becoming the poem”; and more.

Note: This episode originally aired on Sounds True One, where these special episodes of Insights at the Edge are available to watch live on video and with exclusive access to Q&As with our guests. Learn more at join.soundstrue.com.

Mark Nepo: Authentic Expression is Heart-Based

“All my work is about devotion to the messy, magnificent human journey”

—Mark Nepo

Every day, we learn. We take in more of the new. And yet, we can only respond to situations based on what we know already. We rely on the old.

Mark Nepo seems to be asking about the space between. What does it mean to grow and change with grace? What does it mean to have faith in that process? And what does this have to do with writing and expression?

We are constantly tasked to face the unknown using tools that may have only worked for us in the past (and that is freaking scary).

I believe that asking questions is elemental to human nature. But, it is impossible to truly know any of the answers.

For Mark, there is no one right way forward. There is no way out of fear. There is only a sensibility that can be adopted: that is, the willingness to listen. 

In other words, there are no objectives. There are no end products. The “answer” is in letting go of resistance to what we know, have, and are.

That way, the invisible can make itself known.

WITNESSING

“How do we talk about the things that matter that you really can’t see?”

—Mark Nepo

The ephemeral connection between ourselves and the world of essence exists within our hearts. With this practice—this practice of inner trust, perhaps even surrender—we can begin to gesture at expressing the unsayable.

What’s clear about Mark Nepo is that he is first and foremost a writer. However, his ideas can be applied to any form of expression.

To bear witness in writing, Mark advises giving full attention to whatever is in front of you, then describing it in as much detail as possible. It’s important not to make it seem magnificent or assign it “a bunch of meaning.”

Don’t evaluate it.

We are the observers and not yet the translators.

There is another part to it. Look inward. Feel what is moving through you at that moment. “Paint” that feeling with words. Don’t judge. Don’t bother with meaning. This disposition is inherently freeing. 

In this state (and I fall in and out of it even as I write this), reality moves up to our eyes like a mirror. We can look at it and hear it, be part of it.

THE INVISIBLE WORLD

“You can’t see light except for what it illuminates. All the forces that hold us and support us are invisible”

—Mark Nepo

We name things all the time. We have to. It keeps chaos at bay.

But, naming things tends to keep us separate from them. That is this and I am this and you are there and I am here.

In his Insights at the Edge episode with Tami, Mark mentions that we are accustomed to listening in this way.

We immediately assign names, places, spaces, reasons, meaning and significance to everything we see and feel. We judge and assume (partly because it is efficient; partly because we are so used to doing it).

This is in stark contrast to the “essence of wholehearted presence, however and whenever that appears.”

IMMERSION

“The truth is, I barely understand half of what comes through me. The other half leads me”

—Mark Nepo

Immersion is a different kind of listening.

Rather than naming, one engages in a mutual conversation with the world. Discovery and creation unite as the byproduct of participation in oneness.

For Mark, immersion is a way to stop resisting our naturalness and be… whatever it is we were meant to be, as humans.

When he talks about “the things that matter,” what he seems to mean is the invisible world, “that which holds us together.” In immersion, we have the chance to interact with the invisible source of our unity.

Like the fiery and untouchable sun from which our individual experiences emanate.

WHOLEHEARTEDNESS

“It’s a gift that we can’t reach what we’re trying to say or what we see, because of all that it gives us”

—Mark Nepo

In his interview, Mark says to Tami about art-making, “What matters more is our wholeheartedness than whether we do it well.”

Tami’s response struck me. “I notice, as you offer that answer, there’s a part of me that really softens.”

Creation can be a meeting place. Rather than prescribing, you meet something somewhere, and then you embrace whatever happens. You accept what is present—and in return, you are accepted just as you are.

Wholeheartedness: letting go of expectation for the sake of the unsayable.

SELF-EXPRESSION

“Just because I write it doesn’t mean that I have the meaning of it all”

—Mark Nepo

As a writing teacher, I often tell my students that if they’re stuck, they may not be empty of ideas. In fact, they may be too full.

Creating space for the heart allows the bubbles to rise up. Like attracts like. We see what we see.

“If you’re not quite there, go back to the heart of whatever the expression is about, and get closer, and get stiller, and put your defenses down, and get closer. … Go back and have a more open heart, and see what comes then.”

Sometimes, it’s unpleasant.

Sometimes, it’s utterly nonsensical.

Poetry, as one possible example of this art, has long emptied itself of pragmatic purpose and precise meaning for the sake of beauty and potentiality.

You may end up with something that you don’t understand for years. You may just take that thing out later and realize what you meant. Authentic expression is not a product. It’s a message from you to you, from the universe to the universe.

And it is always miraculous.

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Elizabeth Stanley on Trauma-Sensitive Mindfulness: Whe...

Meditation is often understood as a way to find calm by turning inward. Yet for many people, that inward focus can feel overwhelming instead of grounding. The body may tighten, emotions may rise quickly, or the mind may feel harder to settle. These responses are not a sign of failure. They reflect how the nervous system holds and processes past experiences. Trauma sensitive mindfulness offers a way to approach awareness with more care, allowing space for safety, pacing, and choice.

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  • Flexible Practice: Meditation can include movement, choice, and external focus to support safety
  • Healing Approach: Awareness becomes effective when paired with pacing, care, and nervous system support

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What Is Trauma Sensitive Mindfulness and How It Differs from Traditional Mindfulness

Trauma sensitive mindfulness begins with a simple truth. The present moment does not feel safe for everyone. Turning inward can bring up intense sensations or emotions, and traditional mindfulness does not always account for how trauma shapes this experience.

This approach offers a gentler entry point. It considers how the body responds before asking it to be still. Instead of pushing through discomfort, it allows for choice, movement, and grounding.

Mindfulness then becomes less about doing it right and more about building a relationship with our experience. We learn to notice what feels supportive, pause when needed, and meet ourselves with care.

Elizabeth Stanley’s Approach to Trauma Sensitive Mindfulness and Healing

Elizabeth Stanley’s work brings clarity to why trauma sensitive mindfulness matters and how it can be practiced in a way that truly supports healing. Her perspective is grounded in both research and lived experience, creating a bridge between science and personal transformation.

Her Background in Trauma and Resilience

Stanley’s background includes years of studying resilience under extreme stress, alongside her own journey through trauma recovery. She emphasizes that resilience is not simply about mental strength. It is about the capacity of the nervous system to return to balance after disruption.

Through trauma sensitive mindfulness, she highlights how this capacity can be strengthened over time. The practice becomes less about observing thoughts and more about learning how to stay connected to the body without becoming overwhelmed.

The Limits of Traditional Mindfulness Practices

In her teaching, Stanley also speaks to the limitations of traditional mindfulness approaches. Many practices assume that the body can tolerate sustained attention. For someone carrying unresolved trauma, that assumption may not hold true.

Trauma sensitive mindfulness acknowledges that awareness alone is not always enough. Without support, attention can amplify distress rather than ease it. By integrating regulation and pacing, this approach creates a more supportive path that allows mindfulness to unfold gradually.

Why Trauma Sensitive Mindfulness Changes the Way We Practice Meditation

When we begin to understand mindfulness through the lens of trauma sensitivity, the practice itself starts to shift. Meditation is no longer about holding attention in one place at all costs. It becomes a responsive and adaptive experience.

Meditation Through the Lens of Trauma Sensitivity

In trauma sensitive mindfulness, meditation can include a wide range of options. A person might keep their eyes open, shift their focus between internal and external awareness, or engage in gentle movement. These choices are not distractions from the practice. They are part of the practice.

This flexibility helps create a sense of stability. It allows the practitioner to remain engaged without pushing beyond their capacity.

Creating Safety Within the Practice

Safety is not treated as an outcome. It is the foundation. Trauma sensitive mindfulness invites us to notice when something feels supportive and when it does not. That noticing becomes a form of guidance.

Over time, this builds trust. The practitioner begins to feel that they can stay present without losing themselves in the experience. Meditation then becomes a space where healing can happen at a natural pace.

When Trauma Sensitive Mindfulness Is Needed Beyond Standard Meditation

There are times when traditional mindfulness practices may not provide the support someone needs. Trauma sensitive mindfulness helps us recognize those moments with clarity and care.

Recognizing Signs That Mindfulness Alone Is Not Enough

Some people notice that meditation brings up anxiety, numbness, or a sense of disconnection. Others may feel flooded by emotion or unable to stay grounded. These experiences are not signs of failure. They are signals from the nervous system.

Trauma sensitive mindfulness encourages us to respond to these signals rather than push through them.

Expanding Beyond Stillness Into Regulation

In these moments, the practice may shift. Instead of remaining still, a person might focus on their surroundings, engage in movement, or connect with a steady rhythm like walking or breathing with sound.

These forms of regulation help restore balance. They create a pathway back to presence that feels supportive rather than overwhelming.

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The Role of the Nervous System in Trauma Sensitive Mindfulness Practice

Trauma sensitive mindfulness recognizes that the nervous system plays a central role in how we experience awareness. Before we can rest in presence, the body needs to sense that it is safe enough to do so.

  • The nervous system constantly interprets signals of safety and threat, often outside of conscious awareness
  • Trauma can leave the body in patterns of activation or shutdown that shape how mindfulness feels
  • Trauma sensitive mindfulness introduces gentle ways to support regulation before deep attention is invited
  • Small moments of ease help the nervous system learn that presence can be safe
  • Choice allows the practitioner to stay connected without feeling trapped in the experience

As these patterns begin to shift, mindfulness becomes more accessible. The body no longer experiences awareness as something to defend against. Instead, it becomes a place where steadiness can grow.

How to Practice Trauma Sensitive Mindfulness Safely and Effectively

Practicing trauma sensitive mindfulness begins with a willingness to move at the pace of the body. There is no need to force stillness or sustain attention beyond what feels manageable. Instead, we begin by noticing what feels supportive in the moment.

This might include grounding attention in the senses, feeling the contact of the body with a chair, or simply noticing the environment. At times, it may mean stepping away from internal awareness and focusing outward. These choices are not interruptions. They are expressions of care.

Over time, this approach builds a sense of trust. The practitioner learns that they can engage with mindfulness without becoming overwhelmed. Safety becomes something that is felt, not something that is assumed. From this foundation, awareness can deepen in a way that feels steady and sustainable.

Bringing Trauma Sensitive Mindfulness into Daily Life and Relationships

Trauma sensitive mindfulness does not remain confined to formal practice. It naturally extends into daily life. It can be present in the way we pause before responding, in how we notice tension in the body, or in the decision to take a moment of rest.

In relationships, this awareness can create space. Instead of reacting automatically, we begin to sense what is happening within us. This allows for more thoughtful responses and a greater sense of connection.

These small moments matter. They reflect a shift from striving to be present toward allowing presence to emerge. In this way, mindfulness becomes integrated into the rhythm of everyday life.

Building Resilience Through Trauma Sensitive Mindfulness Over Time

Resilience develops gradually. It is shaped through repeated experiences of safety, awareness, and regulation. Trauma sensitive mindfulness supports this process by honoring the body’s natural pace.

Each moment of grounded awareness strengthens the nervous system’s capacity to remain present. Over time, this creates a sense of stability that can hold a wider range of experiences.

This path is not about reaching a fixed state. It is about developing a relationship with ourselves that is steady, responsive, and compassionate. Through trauma sensitive mindfulness, we begin to discover that presence is not something we force. It is something that becomes possible as the body learns it is safe to be here.

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Final Thoughts

Trauma sensitive mindfulness invites a more compassionate way of being present. Rather than pushing through discomfort, it encourages us to listen to the body and move at a pace that feels supportive.

Elizabeth Stanley’s insights remind us that awareness and regulation go hand in hand. As we honor both, mindfulness becomes a steady, healing practice that meets us exactly where we are.

Frequently Asked Questions About Trauma Sensitive Mindfulness

What makes trauma sensitive mindfulness different from trauma informed care?

Trauma sensitive mindfulness is a specific approach within the broader framework of trauma informed care. While trauma informed care can apply to many fields, such as healthcare or education, trauma sensitive mindfulness focuses directly on how mindfulness practices are adapted to support nervous system safety and regulation.

Can trauma sensitive mindfulness be practiced without a teacher?

Yes, it can be practiced individually, especially with gentle awareness and self-guided pacing. However, some people benefit from working with a trained practitioner who understands trauma and can offer guidance when difficult experiences arise.

Is trauma sensitive mindfulness suitable for beginners?

Yes, it is often more accessible for beginners because it emphasizes choice and flexibility. Instead of requiring strict focus, it allows people to ease into awareness in a way that feels manageable.

How long does it take to see benefits from trauma sensitive mindfulness?

The experience varies from person to person. Some may notice small shifts in awareness and calm within a short time, while bigger changes in resilience and regulation tend to develop gradually through consistent practice.

Can trauma sensitive mindfulness replace therapy?

It is not a replacement for therapy, especially for those working through significant trauma. It can be a supportive complement to therapeutic work, helping individuals build awareness and regulation skills alongside professional support.

What types of practices are included in trauma sensitive mindfulness?

Practices may include grounding exercises, sensory awareness, gentle movement, and flexible attention techniques. The focus is on what supports stability rather than following a fixed method.

How does trauma sensitive mindfulness support physical well-being?

By helping regulate the nervous system, this approach can reduce chronic stress responses in the body. Over time, this may support improved sleep, reduced tension, and a greater sense of ease.

Is it normal to feel discomfort during trauma sensitive mindfulness?

Some discomfort can arise, especially when becoming more aware of internal experiences. The key difference is that this approach encourages responding to discomfort with care, rather than pushing through it.

Can trauma sensitive mindfulness be practiced in short moments?

Yes, it is well suited for brief, everyday moments. Even a few seconds of grounding or awareness can support regulation and help build consistency over time.

Who can benefit most from trauma sensitive mindfulness?

Anyone can benefit, but it is especially supportive for individuals who find traditional meditation challenging or overwhelming. It offers an alternative path that honors personal capacity.

Michelle Cassandra Johnson is an author, activist, spiritual teacher, racial equity consultant, and intuitive healer. She is the author of six books, including Skill in Action and Finding Refuge. Amy Burtaine is a leadership coach and racial equity trainer. With Robin DiAngelo, she is the coauthor of The Facilitator's Guide for White Affinity Groups. For more, visit https://www.michellecjohnson.com/wisdom-of-the-hive.

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